Islamic Theology: Core Beliefs and Differences Between Sects

Islamic theology (Arabic: ‫ عقيدة‬Aqīdah, plural ‫ عقائد‬ʿaqā'id) is a branch of Islamic studies
regarding the beliefs associated with the Islamic faith. Any religious belief system, or creed, can
be considered an example of aqidah. However, this term has taken a significant technical usage
in Muslim history and theology, denoting those matters over which Muslims hold conviction.
Contents
[hide]
• 1 Introduction
○ 1.1 Six articles of belief
• 2 Proof Aspect
• 3 Types of theology
○ 3.1 Kalam
○ 3.2 Eschatology
○ 3.3 Comparative religion
• 4 Differences between various Muslim groups
○ 4.1 Sunni view
○ 4.2 Shi'a beliefs and practices
 4.2.1 Roots of Religion (Usūl al-Dīn)
 4.2.2 Branches of Religion (Furū al-Dīn)
○ 4.3 Ismaili beliefs
○ 4.4 Mu`tazilite view
• 5 Literature pertaining to creed
○ 5.1 Sunni Literature
○ 5.2 Shia Literature
• 6 See also
• 7 References
• 8 External links
Introduction
Muslims enumerate their creed to include the Six articles of belief. There is a consensus on the
elements of this creed across all spectrums as they are clearly articulated in the qurʾān. Sectarian
differences between Shias and Sunnis are often expressed in differences in branches or
elaboration of creedal beliefs as opposed to the core creed (aqidah). For example, Muslims may
have different ideas regarding the attributes of God or about the purpose of angels. However
there is no dispute on the existence of God, that he has sent his revelation via messengers nor
that man will be held to account and rewarded or punished with heaven or hell.
] Six articles of belief
In a hadith collected in Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim, the Islamic prophet Muḥammad
explains, "Faith is to affirm your faith in Allah, His angels, His Books, His Messengers and the
Last Day, and to believe in the Divine Destiny whether it be good or bad."
The six Sunni articles of belief are:
1. Belief in God (Allah), the one and only one worthy of all worship (tawhid).
2. Belief in all the Prophets (nabi) and Messengers (rusul) sent by God
3. Belief in the Angels (mala'ika).
4. Belief in the Books (kutub) sent by God[1] (including the Qurʾān).
5. Belief in the Day of Judgment (qiyama) and in the Resurrection (life after death).
6. Belief in Destiny (Fate) (qadar).
The first five are based on several Qurʾānic creeds:
Whoever disbelieveth in God and His angels and His scriptures and His messengers and
the Last Day, he verily wandered far stray (4:136)
Who is an enemy of God, His Angels, His Messengers, Gabriel and Michael! Then, lo!
God is an enemy to the disbelievers (2:98)
…righteous is he who believeth in God and the Last Day and the angels and the scripture
and the prophets (2:177)
…believer believe in God and His angels and His scriptures and His messengers (2:285)
The sixth point made it into the creed because of the first theological controversy in Islām.
Although not connected with the sunni-shiʿi controversy about the succession, the majority of
Twelfer Shiʿites do not stress God's limitless power (qadar), but rather is boundless justice ʿadl
as the sixth point of believe – this does not mean that Sunnis deny his justice, or Shiʿites negate
his power, just the emphasis is different.
In Sunni and Shia view, having Iman literally means to have belief in Six articles. However the
importance of Iman relies heavily upon reasons. Islam explicitly asserts that belief should be
maintained in that which can be proven using faculties of perception and conception.
Proof Aspect
One is required to examine the evidences Islam provides to be convinced to the point of having
no doubt. This is indicated in the Arabic word for verse (i.e. verses of Koran) which translates to
mean the following: sign, miracle, proof, etc. After all, this lays the foundation for acting on the
secondary matters which would be the rights and regulations of Islam. So a believer is not
supposed to be in the position of relying only on faith as there are verses of the Koran that
condemn blind following, questioning its integrity.
Types of theology
Muslim theology is the theology that derived from the Qur'an and Hadith. The contents of
Muslim theology can be divided into theology proper such as theodicy, eschatology,
anthropology, apophatic theology, and comparative religion.
Kalam
Main article: Kalam
Kalam is the Islamic philosophy of seeking theological principles through dialectic. In Arabic,
the word literally means "speech". A scholar of kalam is referred to as a mutakallim (Muslim
theologian; plural mutakallimiin).
Eschatology
Main article: Islamic eschatology
Eschatology is literally understood as the last things or ultimate things and in Muslim theology,
eschatology refers to the end of this world and what will happen in the next world or hereafter.
Eschatology covers the death of human beings, their souls after their bodily death, the total
destruction of this world, the resurrection of human souls, the final judgments of human deeds by
Allah after the resurrection, and the rewards and punishments for the believers and non-believers
respectively. The places for the believers in the hereafter are known as Paradise and for the non-
believers as Hell.
Comparative religion
Main article: Islam and other religions
Comparative religion in Muslim theology is about the differences and similarities between
Muslim theology and other theologies such as Christian, Jewish theologies as explained in the
Qur'an and the Prophetic traditions.
Differences between various Muslim groups
In the history of Muslim theology, there have been theological schools among Muslims
displaying both similarities and differences with each other in regard to beliefs.
Sunni view
Sunni Muslims hold that there are six articles of belief: belief in Allah, in angels, in divinely
revealed scripture, in prophets, in the "Last Day" or end times, and in destiny.
Shi'a beliefs and practices
Shiìte Muslims hold that there are five articles of belief: the Divine Oneness and Justice, the
Prophethood, the Imamate, and eschatology. The Shi'ite do not believe in complete
predestination, or complete free will. They believe that human life is a mixture of free will and
predestination.
Roots of Religion (Usūl al-Dīn)
1. Tawhīd (Oneness): The Oneness of Allah.
2. Adalah (Justice): The Justice of Allah.
3. Nubuwwah (Prophethood): Allah has appointed perfect and infallible prophets and
messengers to teach mankind the religion (i.e. a perfect system on how to live in
"peace".)
4. Imamah (Leadership): God has appointed specific leaders to lead and guide mankind — a
prophet appoints a custodian of the religion before his demise.
5. Qiyamah (The Day of Judgment): Allah will raise mankind for Judgment
Branches of Religion (Furū al-Dīn)
1. Salat (Worship) – The 5 daily prayers.
2. Sawm (Fast) – Fasting during the month of Ramadan.
3. Hajj (Pilgrimage) – Undertaking the pilgrimage to Mecca.
4. Zakaat (Poor-rate) – Paying the poor-due.
5. Khums (One-fifth) – Paying a tax of 20%, which is levied on un-taxed, annual profit.
6. Jihad (Struggle/Striving) – Struggling to earn the favor of God. The greater jihad, "al-
Jihad al-Akbar", is the struggle against the evil within one's own soul. The lesser jihad,
"al-Jihad al-Asghar", is where one fights on the battlefield in defence of his religion when
attacked.
7. Amr-Bil-Ma'rūf (Promotion) – Encouraging people to perform good deeds.
8. Nahi-Anil-Munkar (Dissuasion) – Discouraging people from performing sin.
9. Tawalla (Re-affirmation) – To love Ahl al-Bayt.
10. Tabarra (disassociation from the enemies of Islam) – To disassociate oneself from the
enemies of the Ahl al-Bayt.
Ismaili beliefs
The branch of Islam known as the Ismāˤīlī is the second largest Shiˤa community. They observe
the following pillars of Islam:
1. Tawhīd
2. Imāmah
3. Nubuwwah
4. Qiyāmah
5. Ṣalāt
Mu`tazilite view
In terms of the relationship between human beings and their creator, Mu`tazilites emphasize
human free will over predestination and God's justice over God's omnipotence. Mu'tazilites also
believe in the use of logic to deduct the true meanings of the Qur'an. This, combined with the
principal of Ijtihad, led to their belief in Dynamic Fiqh.
Literature pertaining to creed
Many Muslim scholars have attempted to explain Islamic creed in general, or specific aspects of
aqidah. The following list contains some of the most well-known literature.
Sunni Literature
• Aqeedah at-Tahawiyya or "The Fundamentals of Islamic Creed by Imam Tahawi. Has
been accepted by almost all Sunni Muslims (Atharis, Ash'aris, Maturidis).[2] It was well
explained by Ibn Abu al-Iz.[3]
• Aqeedah al-Waasittiyah by Ibn Taymiya.[4]
• Sharh as Sunnah or the Explanation of the Creed by Al-Barbahaaree. Lists approximately
170 points pertaining to the fundamentals of Aqidah.
• Khalq Af'aal al-Ibad (The Creation of the acts of Servants) by Bukhari. It shows the
opinion of early scholars (Salaf) but it does not cover all topics.
• Ulu by al-Dhahabi. Details the opinions of early scholars.
• Ibaanah by Abu al-Hasan al-Ash'ari. Accepted by Atharis and early Ash'aris.
Shia Literature
• Shi'a Muḥammad Ḥusayn al-Ṭabāṭabāʼī: translated by Hossein Nasr
• Root and Branches of Faith by Maqbul Hussein Rahim
• Shi'ism Doctrines, Thought and Spirituality by Hossein Nasr
See also
• Islamic eschatology
• Kalam
• Contemporary Islamic philosophy
References
1. ^ http://al-quran.info/#&&sura=2&aya=177&trans=en-
arthur_arberry&show=both,quran-uthmani&format=rows&ver=1.00
2. ^ "Islamic Belief (Al-'Aqida)". Islamicweb.com.
http://islamicweb.com/beliefs/creed/Aqeedatut_Tahaawiyyah.htm. Retrieved 2010-06-
10.
3. ^ "‫"كتاب شرح العقيدة الطحاوية‬. Arabic.islamicweb.com.
http://arabic.islamicweb.com/Books/creed.asp?book=5. Retrieved 2010-06-10.
4. ^ "Aqeedatul-Waasitiyyah – The Text". Salafi Publications.
http://www.salafipublications.com/sps/sp.cfm?
subsecID=AQD04&articleID=AQD040003&articlePages=1. Retrieved 2010-06-10.
External links
• Six Articles of Islamic Faith A description of the Six Articles of Islamic faith.
• Exhaustive Books & Articles on Aqeedah
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_theology"
Categories: Islamic theology | Islamic terms
Hidden categories: Articles containing Arabic language text
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Salafi Creed Vs Sunni Creed [aqida]
#1 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
• Posts: 2,488
• Joined: 07-October 05
• Location:englaaaand
Posted 31 May 2008 - 11:24 AM
Bismillah.
Salafis On Allah's 'Highness' and Fir'awn :
Sh. Ibn Taymiyya said:
Ibn Taymiyya said:

Allah's Names and Attributes in the Qur'an
[....]
Highness:
[....]
And He has said:
"O Haman! Build me a tower, that I may reach the roads, - the roads of heavens, and that I may
climb up to the God of Moses, though verily I think he [Moses] is a liar." (Ghafir 40/36-37)
Al-Aqidah al-Wasitiyya
http://islamicweb.co.../taimiyah_5.htm
http://www.al-eman.c...toc.asp?BID=275
Sh. Salih Al-Fawzan states in his explanation of the waasitiyyah, as translated by “Aboo
Waheeda As-Salafee”:
Quote
“In it is affirmation of the ‘uluww (highness) of Allah over his creations. Such that Prophet Musa
(’alayhis salaam) affirmed this and called to it. And then Fir’awn denied this.”
Qadi Abu Bakr ibn al-Arabi said:
[...] They (i.e. the anthropomorphists) say: All the firm believers in the oneness of Allah
raise their hands to the heavens when supplicating him, and if Musa had not said to
Pharaoh: “My Lord is in the Heaven.” Pharoah would not have said: “Oh Haamaan! Build
for me a lofty tower in order that I may survey the god of Moses!” (28:38)
We say: “You are lying about Musaa (’alayhis salaam), he never stated such! However,
your conclusion shows that you are indeed the followers of Fir’awn, who believed that the
Creator lies in directions, and thus he desired to climb up to Him on a ladder. He
congratulates you for being of his followers, and he is certainly your Imam!”
http://www.sunnah.or...%20Descent2.htm
Refer also to:
http://seekingilm.co...es/271#more-271
And from the tafsir of Imâm al-Tabarânî from his Tafsîr al-Kabîr under [28:38]:
،‫سعًا مرتفعًا‬
ِ ‫طويلً مّت‬ َ ‫صرًا‬ ْ ‫صْرحًا {؛ أي َق‬ َ ‫جَعل ّلي‬ْ ‫ } َفٱ‬،‫جّرا‬ُ ‫خْذ ِلي آ‬ ِ ‫ن {؛ أي اّت‬ِ ‫طي‬
ّ ‫عَلى ٱل‬َ ‫ن‬
ُ ‫ } َفَأْوِقْد ِلي ٰيَهاَما‬:‫وقولُه تعالى‬
ً‫سمًا مشاَهدا‬ْ‫ج‬
ِ ‫سى‬ َ ‫ن أن إلَه ُمو‬ ّ ‫ وظ‬،‫سماِء‬ّ ‫ن يبُلَغ بصرحِه إلى ال‬
ْ ‫ن بجهلِه أنه َيَتَهّيُأ له أ‬
ّ‫ظ‬َ ،‫س ٰى {؛ أي أصعُد إليه‬ َ ‫طِلُع ِإَل ٰى ِإَل ٰـِه ُمو‬ ۤ ّ‫} ّلَع‬
ّ ‫لي َأ‬
َ ‫ن ذِل‬
‫ك‬ ْ‫ع‬
َ ‫ل‬ُ ‫ َتَعاَلى ا‬،‫شبَهُة‬
َ ‫ل اْلُم‬
ُ ‫كما تقو‬.
Pharaoh thought in his ignorance that by his tower he would be able to reach to the Sky, and
thought that the God of Musa is a body that can be looked at, just as the anthropomorphists say.
Allah is greatly clear of and above that.
http://www.asharis.wordpress.com
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#2 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
• Posts: 2,488
Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:26 PM
Bismillah.
Salafis say al-Istawa' means Istiqrar / Settlement upon the Arsh
Says Sh. Ibn Uthaimeen regarding istawa:
al-Uthaimeen said:
‫ونحن نعلم معنى الستواء ونؤمن به ونقره وهو أنه سبحانه وتعالى عل عرشه واستوى عليه علوا واستقرارا يليق به‬
‫سبحانه وتعالى ولكننا ل نعلم كيفية هذا الستواء‬
rough translation:
We know the meaning of istawa and we believe it and and accept/approve it and He subhanahu
wa ta'ala is upon is His arsh and His establishment thereupon is of aboveness and settledness
(istiqrar) Glorified and Exalted be He. We don't know the modality of this al-istawa'.
http://www.ibnothaim...ticle_793.shtml
Imam Abu Hanifa in Wasiyya al-Imam al-A‘zam ila Abi ‘Amr ‘Uthman al-Batti (p. 10).
‫‪“We assert that Allah established Himself over the throne without His need (hâja) nor‬‬
‫‪settlement (istiqrâr) upon it, for He it is Who preserves the Throne and other than it without‬‬
‫”‪needing any of them.‬‬
‫‪From al-Hafiz ibn Hajar al Asqalani's Fath al-Bari:‬‬
‫قوله )وقال مجاهد استوى‪ :‬عل على العرش( وصله الفريابي عن ورقاء عن ابن أبي نجيح عنه قال ابن بطال اختلف الناس في‬
‫الستواء المذكور هنا فقالت المعتزلة معناه الستيلء بالقهر والغلبة واحتجوا بقول الشاعر‪ :‬قد استوى بشر على العراق من غير ودم‬
‫مهراق وقالت الجسمية معناه الستقرار‬
‫‪Here is a translation of part of what is mentioned above:‬‬
‫‪The Mu`tazila said its meaning is "establishing dominion through subjugation and‬‬
‫‪overpowering" (al-istila' bi al-qahr wa al-ghalaba), citing as a proof the saying of the poet: Bishr‬‬
‫‪established mastery over Iraq without sword and without shedding blood.‬‬
‫"‪The anthropomorphists (al-jismiyya) said: "Its meaning is settledness (al-istiqrar).‬‬
‫‪This meaning was also rejected by Imam al-Izz Ibn Abdas Salaam:‬‬
‫قال الشيخ عز الدين بن عبد السلم رحمه ال ورضي عنه وعّنا به الحمد ل ذي العزة والجلل والقدرة والكمال والنعام والفضال‬
‫الواحد الحد الفرُد الصمد الذي لم يلد ولم يولد ولم يكن له كفوا أحد ليس بجسم مصّور ول جوهٍر محدوٍد مقدر ول يشبه شيئا ول‬
‫يشبهه شيٌء ول تحيط به الجهات ول تكتنفه الرضون ول السموات كان قبل أن كّون المكان ودّبر الزمان وهو الن على ما عليه‬
‫ن(‬ ‫ل عّما َيْفَعلُ َوُهْم ُيسَئُلو َ‬
‫ل )ل ُيسَئ ُ‬‫ل نقمة منه فهي عد ٌ‬ ‫ل وك ّ‬
‫ل نعمة منه فهي فض ٌ‬ ‫كان خَلق الخلق وأعمالهم وقّدر أرزاقهم وآجالهم فك ّ‬
‫سة والستقرار والتمّكن والحلول‬ ‫استوى على العرش المجيد على الوجه الذي قاله وبالمعنى الذي أراده استواء منزها عن المما ّ‬
‫ش وحمَلُته محمولون بلطف قدرته‬ ‫ش بل العر ُ‬
‫والنتقال فتعالى ال الكبير المتعال عما يقوله أهل الغي والضلل بل ل يحمله العر ُ‬
‫ي مريٌد سميٌع‬ ‫طلٌع على هواجس الضمائر وحركات الخواطر ح ّ‬ ‫ل شيء عددا م ّ‬ ‫علما وأحصى ك ّ‬ ‫ل شيٍء ِ‬ ‫مقهورون في قبضته أحاط بك ّ‬
‫ف ول صوت ول ُيتصّور في كلمه أن ينقلب ِمدادًا في اللواح والوراق شكل‬ ‫ي ليس بحر ٍ‬ ‫بصيٌر عليٌم قديٌر متكلم بكلٍم قديم أزل ّ‬
‫ترُمقه العيون والحداق كما زعم أهل الحشو والّنفاق بل الكتابة من أفعال العباد ول ُيتصّور في أفعالهم أن تكون قديمة ويجب‬
‫ل عليه وانتسب إليه أن ُيعتقد عظمته وترعى‬ ‫ق لما د ّ‬
‫حّ‬‫احترامها لدللتها على كلمه كما يجب احترام أسمائه لدللتها على ذاته و ُ‬
‫صلحاء‬‫حرمته ولذلك يجب احترام الكعبة والنبياء والُعباد وال ّ‬
‫‪Here is a short translation [Shaykh GF Haddad]:‬‬
‫‪What Allah Is Not‬‬
‫‪He is not a body endowed with form. He is not a substance confined by boundary or‬‬
‫‪measurement. He resembles nothing and nothing resembles Him. Directions and sides do not‬‬
‫‪encompass Him. Neither the earths nor the heavens contain Him.‬‬
‫)‪His Preternity (Beginninglessness‬‬
‫)‪He was before He brought place and time into existence, and He is now as He ever was. (1‬‬
His Acts
He created creatures as well as their actions. He decreed the extent of their sustenance and the
term of their lives. Every benefit from Him is from His favor, and every punishment is from His
justice. (He will not be questioned as to what He does, but they will be questioned.) (21:23)
He established Himself over the glorious Throne in the way that He says and the meaning
He intends, “established” in a manner transcending contact (mumâssa), settledness
(istiqrâr), fixity (tamakkun), indwelling (hulûl), or movement (intiqâl). (2)
Exalted is Allah the Greatest, the Most High, far above the claims of the people of error and
misguidance! Never can the Throne carry Him, rather the Throne and the Throne-Bearers are
carried up by the subtlety of His infinite might, and all are powerless (maqhûrûn) in His grasp.
(3)
---------------------------
The footnotes to the above also contain some important quotes:
Footnotes for the above:
(1)- Cf. hadith of the Prophet ρ : kâna allâhu wa lâ shay’a ma‘ahu / ghayruhu / qablahu – “Allah
existed and nothing existed together with Him / other than Him / before Him.” Narrated from
Burayda by al-Hakim in al-Mustadrak (2:341), who declared it sound (sahîh) – al-Dhahabi
concurred – and from ‘Imran ibn Husayn by Bukhari, Ibn Hibban with two sound chains in his
Sahih (14:7 #6140, 14:11 #6142), and Ibn Abi Shayba in his Musannaf. See Appendix, “Allah is
now as He ever was.”
(2) See the appendix entitled “Istiwâ’ is a Divine Act” in the translation of Bayhaqi’s al-Asma’
wa al-Sifat, published separately. Note that the “Salafis” deny most of the above: “ The ‘Salafis’
and Ibn Taymiyya assert that settledness takes place over the Throne…. Ibn Taymiyya
strenuously asserts that Allah descends, and can be above (fawq) and below (taht) ‘without
how’…. and that the school of the Salaf is the affirmation of everything that the Qur’an stated
concerning aboveness (fawqiyya), belowness (tahtiyya), and establishment over the Throne.”
Abu Zahra, al-Madhahib al-Islamiyya (p. 320-322). Ibn Rushd in Sharh al-‘Utbiyya stated that
Malik’s position is: “The Throne is not Allah’s location of settledness (mawdi‘ istiqrâr
Allâh).” As quoted in Fath al-Bari (1959 ed. 7:124 #3592).
(3) “We assert that Allah established Himself over the throne without His need (hâja) nor
settlement (istiqrâr) upon it, for He it is Who preserves the Throne and other than it
without needing any of them.” Abu Hanifa, Wasiyya al-Imam al-A‘zam ila Abi ‘Amr ‘Uthman
al-Batti (p. 10). “Allah established Himself over the Throne in the sense that He said and the
meaning that He wills, with an establishment that transcends touch, settlement, location,
immanence, and displacement. The Throne does not carry him, rather the Throne and its carriers
are carried by the subtleness of His power, subdued under His grip.” Al-Ash‘ari, al-Ibana ‘an
‫‪Usul al-Diyana, Mahmud ed. (p. 21); Sabbagh ed. (p. 35),“The carrier of the Throne and of its‬‬
‫‪carriers is in reality Allah Himself.” Abu Sulayman al-Khattabi (d. 386) as quoted in Bayhaqi, al-‬‬
‫‪Asma’ wa al-Sifat (al-Hashidi ed. 2:279-280).‬‬
‫‪Here is how Ibn Hajar quoted Ibn Rushd's saying from Imam Malik:‬‬
‫قال أبو الوليد بن رشد في " شرح العتبية " إنما نهى مالك لئل يسبق إلى وهم الجاهل أن العرش إذا تحرك يتحرك ال بحركته كما‬
‫‪.‬يقع للجالس منا على كرسيه‪ ،‬وليس العرش بموضع استقرار ال‪ ،‬تبارك ال وتنزه عن مشابهة خلقه‬
‫‪And finally, here is Imam al-Bayhaqi on Istiwa and rejection of Istiqrar, in his al-I'tiqad:‬‬
‫ن‪ 56‬أخبرنا علي بن محمد بن عبد‬ ‫حي َ‬

‫سَماِء الّدْنَيا ِ‬
‫ل َلْيَلٍة إَِلى َ‬
‫ل ُك ّ‬
‫جّ‬
‫عّز َو َ‬
‫ل َ‬
‫ل ا ُّ‬
‫سِتَواِء << " َيْنِز ُ‬
‫لْ‬‫ل ِفي ا ِ‬
‫ب اْلَقْو ِ‬
‫ي << َبا ُ‬
‫عِتَقاُد ِلْلَبْيَهِق ّ‬
‫لْ‬
‫اِ‬
‫ال بن بشران ‪ ،‬ثنا أحمد بن سلمان ‪ ،‬قال ‪ :‬قرئ على سليمان بن الشعث ‪ ،‬وأخبرنا أبو علي الروذباري ‪ ،‬أنا أبو بكر بن داسة ‪ ،‬ثنا‬
‫أبو داود ‪ ،‬ثنا القعنبي ‪ ،‬عن مالك ‪ ،‬عن ابن شهاب ‪ ،‬عن أبي سلمة بن عبد الرحمن ‪ ،‬وعن أبي عبد ال الغر ‪ ،‬عن أبي هريرة ‪،‬‬
‫رضي ال عنه ‪ ،‬أن رسول ال صلى ال عليه وسلم قال ‪ " :‬ينزل ال عز وجل كل ليلة إلى سماء الدنيا حين يبقى ثلث الليل الخر‬
‫فيقول ‪ :‬من يدعوني فأستجيب له ‪ ،‬من يسألني فأعطيه ‪ ،‬من يستغفرني فأغفر له " قال رحمه ال ‪ :‬وهذا حديث صحيح رواه جماعة‬
‫من الصحابة عن النبي صلى ال عليه وسلم ‪ ،‬وأصحاب الحديث فيما ورد به الكتاب والسنة من أمثال هذا ‪ ،‬ولم يتكلم أحد من‬
‫الصحابة والتابعين في تأويله ‪ ،‬ثم إنهم على قسمين ‪ :‬منهم من قبله وآمن به ولم يؤوله ووكل علمه إلى ال ونفى الكيفية والتشبيه عنه ‪.‬‬
‫ومنهم من قبله وآمن به وحمله على وجه يصح استعماله في اللغة ول يناقض التوحيد ‪ .‬وقد ذكرنا هاتين الطريقتين في كتاب السماء‬
‫والصفات في المسائل التي تكلموا فيها من هذا الباب ‪ ،‬وفي الجملة يجب أن يعلم أن استواء ال سبحانه وتعالى ليس باستواء اعتدال‬
‫عن اعوجاج ول استقرار في مكان ‪ ،‬ول مماسة لشيء من خلقه ‪ ،‬لكنه مستو على عرشه كما أخبر بل كيف بل أين ‪ ،‬بائن من جميع‬
‫خلقه ‪ ،‬وأن إتيانه ليس بإتيان من مكان إلى مكان ‪ ،‬وأن مجيئه ليس بحركة ‪ ،‬وأن نزوله ليس بنقلة ‪ ،‬وأن نفسه ليس بجسم ‪ ،‬وأن وجهه‬
‫ليس بصورة ‪ ،‬وأن يده ليست بجارحة ‪ ،‬وأن عينه ليست بحدقة ‪ ،‬وإنما هذه أوصاف جاء بها التوقيف ‪ ،‬فقلنا بها ونفينا عنها التكييف ‪،‬‬
‫فقد قال ‪ :‬ليس كمثله شيء ‪ ،‬وقال ‪ :‬ولم يكن له كفوا أحد ‪ ،‬وقال ‪ :‬هل تعلم له سميا‬
‫]‪[arabic quotes courtesy of Sidi Abul Hasan‬‬

‫‪http://www.asharis.wordpress.com‬‬
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‫‪#3‬‬ ‫‪faqir‬‬
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Posted 01 June 2008 - 07:24 AM
Bismillah.
Salafis object to declaring Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala transcendent beyond possessing

body, parts and limbs:
Sh. Ibn Baz said:

Sh. Ibn Baz said:
‫أهل السنة ل ينفون عن ال إل ما نفاه عن نفسه‬
9- ‫ تنزيه ال سبحانه عن الجسم والحدقة والصماخ‬- ‫ هداه ال‬- ‫ثم ذكر الصابوني‬
‫ وهذا ليس بمذهب أهل السنة بل هو من أقوال أهل الكلم‬، ‫واللسان والحنجرة‬
‫ فإن أهل السنة ل ينفون عن ال إل ما نفاه عن نفسه أو‬، ‫المذموم وتكلفهم‬
‫نفاه رسوله صلى ال عليه وسلم ول يثبتون له إل ما أثبته لنفسه أو أثبته له‬
‫رسوله صلى ال عليه وسلم ولم يرد في النصوص نفي هذه المور ول إثباتها‬
‫ ويغني عن ذلك قول‬، ‫فالواجب الكف عنها وعدم التعرض لها ل بنفي ول إثبات‬
‫أهل السنة في إثبات صفات ال وأسمائه أنه ل يشابه فيها خلقه وأنه سبحانه ل‬
‫ )ل يوصف ال إل بما وصف به نفسه‬:‫ قال المام أحمد رحمه ال‬.‫ند له ول كفو له‬
‫)أو وصفه به رسوله صلى ال عليه وسلم ل يتجاوز القرآن والحديث‬.
9_ Then As-Sabuni –May Allah guide him- mentioned declaring Allah transcendent beyond
possessing body (al-jism), pupils (al-hadaqa), auditory meatus (al-simâkh), tongue (al-lisân), and
larynx (al-hanjara); [End of Sabuni's words- beginning of Ibn Baz's words] and this is not the
position of Ahl al-Sunna but rather that of the scholars of condemned kalâm and their
contrivance , for Ahl As-sunnah do not negate something about Allah except what He negates
about Hisself or what his Messenger ‫ صلى ال عليه وسلم‬negated, and they do not affirm for Him
(Allah) except what He affirmed for Hisself or what the Messenger of Allah ‫صلى ال عليه وسلم‬
affirmed for Him, and it was not mentioned in the nusoos (the Quran and Sunnah) negation of
these things (that As-Sabuni mentioned) or its affirmation; so it is obligatory to stop there and
not to confront it with neither negation or affirmation, and what Ahl As-sunnah said suffices in
the affirmation of Allah's attributes and names that He does resemble in it his creation, and that
He (glorified be He) has no match. Imam Ahmad [rahimahu Allah] said: "Allah is not to be
described except with what He described Himself with or what His Messenger described Him
with, it does not
exceed the Quran and Hadith".
Compare this statement to what Imam Abu Ja'far at-Tahawi says in point number 38 of his
creedal work:
38. He is beyond having limits placed on Him, or being restricted, or having parts or limbs. Nor
is He contained by the six directions as all created things are.
So what then is the shaykh's opinion of Imam Abu Ja'far at-Tahawi?
Our liegelord Àli ibn Abi Talib, Allah be well-pleased with him is reported by Abu Nuàym in
Hilyat al-Awliya' (1:73) to have said:
"He – glorious and exalted – spoke to Musa directly (takliman) without limbs, without organs,
without lips, and without uvula!"
Similarly, Shah Wali Allah al-Dihlawi said in his al-I`tiqad al-Sahih, printed with Siddiq Hasan
Khan's commentary on the margins of Nu`man al-Alusi's Jala' al-Àynayn:
"He is neither an indivisible substance, nor an accident, nor a body, nor is He spatially bounded,
nor does He possess direction."
Imam al-Kawthari said about Ibn Taymiyya's similar obfuscation:
"These words are complete impudence. What did he do with all the verses declaring Allah
Most High to be far removed from anything like unto Him? Does he expect that the idiocy
that every single idiot can come up with be addressed with a specific text? Is it not enough
that Allah Most High said: {There is nothing whatsoever like Him} (42:11)? Or does he
consider it permissible for someone to say: Allah eats this, chews that, and tastes this, just
because no text mentions the opposite? This is disbelief laid bare and pure
anthropomorphism."
Al-Kawthari, Maqalat (p. 350-353). [latter three quote translations courtesy of sh. Gibril]
Also, in Imam al-Kawthari's ‫ فتن المجسمة وصنوف مخازيهم‬it is mentioned that Imam ‘Abd al-Qāhir
al-Baghdādi mentioned in his book al-Asmā’ wa ’l-Sifāt:
‫إن الشعري وأكثر المتكلمين قالوا بتكفير كل مبتدع كانت بدعته كفرا أو أدت إلى كفر كمن زعم أن لمعبوده صورة أو أن له‬
‫ ول إشكال لذي لب في تكفير الكرامية مجسمة خراسان في قولهم إن ال جسم‬. ‫حدا ونهاية أو أنه يجوز عليه الحركة والسكون‬
‫له حد ونهاية من تحته وإنه مماس لعرشه وإنه محل الحوادث وإنه يحدث فيه قوله وإرادته أهــ‬
Indeed, Abu al-Hasan al-Ash‘ari [(d. 324 / 936; Baghdad) the supreme imam of orthodox
Muslims in the field of beliefs and al-tauhīd], and most experts in orthodox belief and its proof
and defense [al mutakallimun] insisted on the unbelief of every sectarian [mubtadi‘] whose
heresy was in itself outright unbelief, or directly implied unbelief as, for example, whoever held
that what he worshipped had an image [sūrah], or a limit [hadd], or extremity [nihāyah], or that
[what he worshipped] might move or be still. There is no difficulty for anybody who has a mind
to comprehend the unbelief of the Karrāmiyah, the anthropomorphists [al-mujassimah] of
Khurāsān, for claiming that He, the Transcendent, is a body, and has a limit, and an extremity
underneath Him, and that He contacts His throne, and that He is the site of occurrences, and that
speech and will recur to Him again and again, [whereas the truth of the matter is that His speech
and His will are preeternal and one and single].
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#4 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis On Allah possessing limits
Says Sh. Ibn Baz on his 'commentary' on al-Àqida al-Tahawiyya:
Sh. bin Baz said:

‫ فهو سبحانه ل يعلم حدوده إل هو سبحانه‬،‫فمراده بالحدود يعني التي يعلمها البشر‬
By hudood (limits) the author means such as known by humans since no one except Allah
Almighty knows his limits.
see footnote 3: http://www.furqaan.c...muslimcreed.htm
This is, of course, in complete contradiction to what Imam Abu Ja'far al-Tahawi himself says:
By the way, Abu Sa'id ad-Darimi, the author of al-Radd ala Bishr al-Marisi, said, as quoted by
Sh. Ibn Taymiyah in Dar' at-Ta'arud without rebuke (2/28-29):
Ibn Taymiyya said:

The section on the Hadd (limit) and the 'Arsh
Abu Sa'id said:
The opponent also claimed that Allah does not possess a Hadd (limit), Ghayah (restriction), or
Nihayah (end). He said: And this is the basis upon which Jahm (ibn Safwan) built his
misguidnace and derived all of his errors. It has not reached us that anyone besides Jahm in the
world proceeded him with it. Someone who was discussing this with him (Jahm) said to him: I
have come to know your intent oh non-Arab. You intend that Allah is nothing, because all of the
creation have known that there is nothing that is called a "thing" except that it has a Hadd (limit),
a Ghayah (restriction) and an attribute, and that what has no limit, restriction or attribute is
nothingness.
So that which is a "thing" must necessarily be described with attributes. Nothingness is described
with no limit or restriction. Your statement: He has no limit means that He is nothing.
Abu Sa'id said:
Allah Ta'ala has a limit that no one knows but Him and it is not allowed for anyone to imagine a
limit to His limit in himself, however, he is to beleive in the limit and relegate the knolwedge of
that to Allah. His place (Makan) also has a limit and He is upon His 'Arsh above the seven
heavens- so these are two limits.
Sh. Ibn Taymiyya himself said in Muwaafaqat al-Manqul (2:29) (republished as Dar' Ta'aarud al-
Àqli wal-Naql (2:58-59):
Quote
There is agreement one and all among the Muslims and the disbelievers [sic] that Allah Most
High is in the heaven and they ascribed it to Him as a limit except al-Marrisi the misguided and
his friends. Even little boys that have not reached puberty know this: when a boy is sad he raises
his hand to his Lord and calls unto Him in the Heaven and nowhere else. Everybody knows of
Allah and His place (makanih) better than the Jahmiyyah! [..]. All this and its like are
corroborations and proofs for a limit, and whoever does not admit it has committed disbelief in
the Divine Revelation and has denied the verses of Allah!
So it is clear that they believe in a God with limits who has a place - contrary to Imam Abu Ja'far
al-Tahawi and the rest of Ahl al-Sunnah!
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#5 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis say al-Istawa' is Julus - sitting
Says Sh. al-Uthaimeen in Majmu Fatawa (vol. 1, no. 57) quoting Ibn al-Qayyim [provided by
sh. Abul Hasan]:
Quote
‫ عن خارجة بن مصعب في قوله تعالى الرحمن على العرش‬4/1303 ‫وأما تفسيره بالجلوس فقد نقل ابن القيم في الصواعق‬
‫ وقد ورد ذكر الجلوس في حديث أخرجه المام أحمد عن ابن عباس‬.‫هـ‬.‫ ا‬."‫ "وهل يكون الستواء إل الجلوس‬:‫( قوله‬1))‫استوى‬
‫ وال أعلم‬.‫رضي ال عنهما مرفوعًا‬
.
rough translation:
with respect to the sitting, Ibn al-Qayyim has reported in As-Sawaaiq 1303/4 from Kharijah bin
Mus'ab with respect to the saying of Allah the Exalted :The ayah: Ar-Rahmanu Alal Arshi
Istawa, "How can the ascension be anything other than sitting?" and the mention of sitting has
been reported in the Hadeeth from Imam Ahmad from Ibn Abbas, may Allah be pleased with
them both, in a Marfu' fashion. And Allah Knows best
And, to quote sh. Abul Hasan:

Ibn al-Qayyim is talking about a non-existent narration in the Musnad of Ahmad [i.e. he has
fabricated] through Kharija who is actually matruk in hadith anyway!
This also reminded me of the book Kitab al-sunna attributed to Àbd Allah ibn Ahmad ibn
Hanbal (d. 290) by the pseudo-salafis, but whose stand in relation to the Sunna and
anthropomorphism can be judged by the following excerpts:
10 ‫ت أبي يقول سمعت خارجة يقول الجهمية كفار بلغوا نساءهم أنهن طوالق‬ ُ ‫حدثني أحمد بن سعيد أبو جعفر الدارمي قال سمع‬
‫ل َتْذِكَرًة‬
ّ ‫شَقى * ِإ‬
ْ ‫ن ِلَت‬
َ ‫ك اْلُقْرآ‬
َ ‫عَلْي‬
َ ‫ ﴿طه * َما َأنَزْلَنا‬: ‫وأنهن ل يحللن لزواجهن ل تعودوا مرضاهم ول تشهدوا جنائزهم ثم تل‬
‫ وهل يكون الستواء ال بجلوس‬، ﴾‫سَتَوى‬ ْ ‫شا‬
ِ ‫عَلى اْلَعْر‬
َ ‫ن‬
ُ ‫حَم‬
ْ ‫ت اْلُعَلى * الّر‬
ِ ‫سَماَوا‬
ّ ‫ض َوال‬
َ ‫لْر‬
َ ‫قا‬
َ ‫خَل‬
َ ‫ن‬
ْ ‫ل ّمّم‬
ً ‫شى * َتنِزي‬
َ‫خ‬ْ ‫ّلَمن َي‬.
Quote
"Is istiwa other than by sitting (julus)?"
page 5, Kitab al-sunna (Cairo: al-Matbaà al-Salafiya, 1349/1930).
Quote
"He saw Him on a chair of gold carried by four angels: one in the form of a man, another in the
form of a lion, another in that of a bull, and another in that of an eagle, in a green garden, outside
of which there was a golden dais."
Page 35, Kitab al-sunna (Cairo: al-Matbaà al-Salafiya, 1349/1930).
The contemporary salafi preacher Dr. Aidh al-Qarni also describes Allah as 'sitting' on His
throne as can be seen in a recording of one of his khutbas.
And finally, in his Tafsir named "an-Nahrul-Madd", the Grammarian Abu Hayyan al-'Andalusi
reported about Ibn Taymiyah:
Quote
In his handwriting, a book of Ahmad Ibn Taymiyah, who was contemporary with us, which he
called "Kitab-ul-‘Arsh", I read: Allah sits on al-Kursi and has left a space for the Messenger of
Allah to sit with Him.... (see scan)
As for us:
Ibn Àsakir in Tabyin Kadhib al-Muftari (p. 150-151) as quoted here says:
The Mushabbiha and Hashwiyya said: Descent is the descent of His person (dhat) through
movement (haraka) and displacement (intiqal), and istiwa' is His sitting on the Throne and
indwelling on top of it. Al-Ashàri took the middle road and said: Descent is one of His attributes
and istiwa' is one of His attributes and an action He did pertaining to the Throne, called istiwa'.
Imam al-Bayhaqi in al-Asma wa al-Sifat (as translated by Sh. Gibril):
The Preternal One (al-Qadîm) is thus elevated over His Throne but neither sitting on (qâ'id) nor
standing on (qâ'im) nor in contact with (mumâss), nor separate from (mubâyin) the Throne -
meaning separate in His Es-sence in the sense of physical separation or distance. For "contact"
and its opposite "separation," "standing" and its opposite "sitting," are all the characteristics of
bodies (ajsâm), whereas "Allah is One, Everlasting, neither begetting nor begotten, and there is
none like Him." (112:1-4) Therefore what is allowed for bodies is impermissible for Him.
Anyone notice any similarities with the beliefs expounded by some of the above 'salafis' and the
following:
In the Bible they wrote :

“Revelation 4:2-11
‘(9) And when the living creatures give glory and honour and thanks to Him Who sits on the
throne, to Him Who lives forever and ever, (10) the twenty-four elders will fall down before Him
Who sits on the throne, and will worship Him Who lives forever and ever, and will cast their
crowns before the throne, saying, For Thou hast maintained my just cause; Thou dost sit on the
throne judging righteously.’Psalms 9:4”.
They wrote:
“God reigns over the nations, God sits on His holy throne.” Psalms 47:8
“...I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, lofty and exalted, with the train of His robe filling the
temple.” Isaiah 6:1
Isaiah Chapter 6, it is written :

“1 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up,
and his train filled the temple.
In the book called Revelation 19:1-10 they wrote:

"And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia;
Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:
For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt
the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand. And again
they said, Alleluia. And her smoke rose up for ever and ever.
And the four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the
throne, saying, Amen; Alleluia.”
The Vision of Rabbi Ishmael

Babylonian Talmud Berakhot 7a:
It was taught:
“Said Rabbi Ishmael ben Elisha: Once I entered into the inner sanctum to offer incense.
And I beheld Akatriel Yah LORD of Hosts sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up.”
Allah's Refuge is sought!

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#6 faqir
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Posted 02 June 2008 - 09:04 PM
Bismillah.
Salafis say the Vision of Allah is in a direction

Dr. Muhammad Khalil Harras [described here as "a great Salafi Aalim and research scholar"]
writes in his “Sharh Aqidah al-Wasitiyyah,” page 73:
Quote
“The Mutazila deny the vision. This denial is based on refusing to accept Allah in any direction
for it is necessary for a thing being seen to be in the direction of the seer...”
Imam Abu Ja'far al-Tahawi says:
35. The Seeing of Allah by the People of the Garden is true, without their vision being all-
encompassing and without the manner of their vision being known. As the Book of our Lord has
expressed it: "Faces on that Day radiant, looking at their Lord." (al-Qiyama 75:22-3) The
explanation of this is as Allah knows and wills. Everything that has come down to us about this
from the Messenger, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, in authentic traditions, is as he
said and means what he intended. We do not delve into that, trying to interpret it according to our
own opinions or letting our imaginations have free rein.
No one is safe in his religion unless he surrenders himself completely to Allah, the Exalted and
Glorified and to His Messenger, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, and leaves the
knowledge of things that are ambiguous to the one who knows them.
And again:
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#7 Abul Hasan
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Assalamu alaikum
I had said the following a few years back:
---------------------
Mashallah! I have seen all this before and these innovators have yet to reply appropriately. The
strange thing with these Ahlul Hawa is that they claim to agree with Imam al-Tahawi's creedo,
but they blatantly go against it with their distortive explanations using such Mubtadi'in like: Ibn
Abi'l Izz (declared a Mubtadi by Mulla Ali al-Qari), Bin Baz, Salih al Fawzan and the latest
Sharh on Tahawiyya by the distorting enemy of al-Asha'ira: Safar al-Hawali - who was exposed
even by his own pseudo-Salafi brethren. This al-Hawali went as far as attacking al-Albani on the
issue of Irja, as did the latest Mubtadi: Falih al Harbi! This is their latest trend: Refuting and
exposing each other! May Allah guide them and keep us away from their Fitna. Amin.
The father of the idea's spread by the Ahlul Bid'a wal Dalala today was no doubt ibn Taymiyya
and his pupil Ibn al Qayyim al Jawziyya, in the name of the Salaf.
Here is a recent list of works on the Taymiyyan way as mentioned by DR GF Haddad:
1. Fataawaa Ibn Taymiyya fil-Meezaan [Ibn Taymiyya's Fatwas under Investigation]. By

the Mauritanian Shaykh al-Sayyid Muhammad Ahmad Miskah ibn al-Àteeq al-Ya`qubi,
Allah reward him. 500 p. (Damascus 2000.)
2. Al-Kaashif al-Sagheer àn Àqaa'id Ibn Taymiyya [Minor Exposure of the Beliefs of
Ibn Taymiyya]. By Saìd Àbd al-Latif Fawdah. 500 p. (Amman 2000).
3. Risaala fil-Radd àla Ibn Taymiyya fi Mas'alati Hawaaditha laa Awwala Laha [Epistle
in Refutation of Ibn Taymiyya in the Question of 'Created Matters without Beginning'].
By al-Imam Baha' al-Din al-Ikhmeemi al-Misri (700-764). Ed. Saìd Àbd al-Latif
Fawdah. 128 p. (Amman 1998) This was written in refutation of Ibn Taymiyya's belief
that the world is of a pre-eternal nature and exists with Allah since pre-eternity as an
"ever-abiding created object" (makhluqan da'iman!), thus making it necessarily existent
in His Essence (mujaban bi al-dhat) and [making Him] not acting deliberately (la faìlan
bi al-ikhtyar), elevated is He beyond that! Dr. al-Buti in Kubra al-Yaqeenaat al-Kawniyya
pointed out that this is nothing other than Aristotelian philosophy and, before him, Imam
Abu Ishaq al-Isfarayini said that whoever holds such a doctrine is considered a kafir.
4. Risaala Shareefa feemaa Yataàllaqu bi Kam al-Baaqi min Ùmr al-Dunya [Noble
Epistle Concerning the Remainder of the Life of this World]. by Imam al-Sanàni. Ed. al-
Wasabi al-Mathani. (Sanà', 1992). This is a refutation of the same heresy as in #3.
5. Al-Qawl al-Wajeeh fi Tanzeeh Allah Taàla àn al-Tashbeeh [The Eminent Discourse
Concerning Divine Transcendence beyond All Resemblance to Created Things]. By
Shaykh al-Sayyid Abul-Hasanayn Àbd Allah ibn Àbd al-Rahman al-Makki al-Hashimi
rahimahullah. 111 p. (Amman 1995.)
6. Al-Salafiyya al-Muàasira: Munaaqashaat wa Ruduud [Contemporary Salafism:

Discussions and Refutations]. By Shaykh al-Sayyid Abul-Hasanayn al-Makki al-Hashimi
7. Al-Farq al-Àzeem bayn al-Tanzeeh wal-Tajseem wayaleeh al-Muqtataf fi Naqd al-

Tuhaf [THe Tremendous Difference between Transcendence and Anthropomorphism].
By Saìd Àbd al-Latif Fawdah. 72 p. (Amman 2001.) Contains a valuable commentary
on al-Shawkaani's Àqida titled al-Tuhaf fi Madhhahib al-Salaf.
8. Tasheeh al-Mafaaheem al-Àqdiyya fil-Sifaat al-Ilaahiyya [The Redress of Doctrinal

Understandings of the Divine Attributes]. By Shaykh Ìsa ibn Maani` al-Himyari. 300 p.
(Cairo 1998.)
---------------------------------------------
Wassalam
Abul Hasan
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#8 sunnistudent
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salam alaykum
Ibn Taymiyyah's Saying of Hawadith with No Beginning Existing Eternally with Allah
This issue is one of the ugliest issues in belief by which Ibn Taymiyyah dissented from the sound
mind and the explicit tradition and Ijma’ of the Muslims. He mentioned this belief in five of his
books: "Minhaj-us-Sunnat-in-Nabawiyyah", "Muwafaqatu Sarih-il-Ma’qul li Sahih-il-Manqul",
"Sharh Hadith-in-Nuzul", "Sharh Hadith ‘Imran Ibn Husayn", and "Naqdu Maratib-il-’Ijma’".
Ibn Taymiyyah's statement in "Minhaj-us-Sunnat-in-Nabawiyyah", Volume I, page 24 is: If you

say to us: You said of the occurrence of the hawadith in Allah, we say to you: Yes, and this
saying of ours is what the Shar’ and mind showed.
He replied to Ibn Hazm for reporting the Ijma’ that Allah existed eternally and no thing existed
with Him, and that the disagreer with this is a kafir. After these words, Ibn Taymiyyah said:
What is stranger than that is his (Ibn Hazm's) reporting the Ijma’ upon the kufr of whoever
contended with the belief that Allah existed eternally by Himself and no thing existed with Him.
Ibn Taymiyyah's statement in "Sharh Hadith ‘Imran Ibn Husayn", page 193,: If the kind of the
creations is assumed to be eternal with Allah, this companionship is not negated by the Shar’ or
the mind, but it is of His perfection. Allah, ta’ala, said that the One Who creates is not equal to
whoever does not create. Then Ibn Taymiyyah said: The creation existed eternally with Him.
Then he said: but many people confuse the self with the kind.
His statement in "Muwafaqatu Sarih-il-Ma’qul li Sahih-il-Manqul", page 291 is: We said: we do

not accept. However, the daily hadith is preceded by hawadith without a beginning.
In the manuscript of "Tashnif-ul-Masami’", page 342, Muhaddith, Usuli Badr-ud-Din az-

Zarkashi reported the agreement of the Muslims upon the kufr of whoever says that the kind of
the world is eternal. After mentioning that the philosophers said the world is eternal by matter
and shape, and that some said it is eternal by matter but its shape is muhdath (has a beginning),
he said: and the Muslims charged them (the philosophers) with deviation and kufr. Before that
Hafiz Ibn Daqiq al-’Id, Qadi ‘Iyad, and Hafiz Ibn Hajar said the like in "Sharh al-Bukhari". Hafiz
as-Subki confirmed this belief about Ibn Taymiyyah in his treatise "ad-Durrat-ul-Mudiyyah" and
as said previously, Abu Sa’id al-’Ala'i did too. This belief was reported also by al-Jalal-ud-
Dawwani in "Sharh-ul-’Adudiyyah". He said: I saw in a writing of Abul-’Abbas Ibn Taymiyyah
the saying that the kind of al-’Arsh is eternal.
The Hanafi ‘Allamah al-Bayyadi mentioned in his book "Isharat-ul-Maram", page 197, after
mentioning the proofs about the beginning of the world: Hence, what Ibn Taymiyyah thought of
al-’Arsh being eternal, as reported in "Sharh-ul-’Adudiyyah", is invalidated.
In his poem, which is famous even among the defenders of Ibn Taymiyyah, and which contained
refuting al-Hilli then Ibn Taymiyyah, among of what as-Subki said: Ibn Taymiyyah has a
refutation to what one of the rawafid (some deviant groups) said that was complete. However, he
mixed the truth with the hashw [The hashw is done by a group called al-Hashwiyyah. It is a vile
group with ignorant members attributing themselves to Imam Ahmad Ibn Hanbal, who is clear of
them. They reported words about him which they misunderstood. Then, they continued with their
bad belief claiming to cling to the Hadith. The best of the muhaddithun (pl. of muhaddith) in his
time, Ibn ‘Asakir used to refrain from teaching them the Hadith and prevent them from attending
his circle in Damascus. This group did not have a head or someone to carry its invalid belief,
except some scattered efforts which were foiled by the Muslims. Then, around the end of the
700th Hijriyyah year, Ibn Taymiyyah advocated the invalid beliefs and ideas of this group.]
whenever he could. He says that there are hawadith with no beginning that occur in Allah. Praise
to Allah; He is clear of what he (Ibn Taymiyyah) thinks about Him.
Ibn Taimiyah is characteristically audacious in rejecting hadith which do not conform with his
purpose at hand even if those hadith are rigorously authentic (sahih) .
A good example of that is the following case: Al-Bukhari reported in his sahih:
“Allah existed and there was nothing other than Him.”
This hadith is in agreement with the [clear-cut] evidence of the Quràn, the sunnah, reason, and
certain consensus (al-ijmà‘ al-mutayaqqan). However, since it conflicts with his belief in the
eternity of the world,45 he turned to another version of this hadith which al-Bukhàri also
reported: “Allah existed and their was nothing before Him.” And he rejected the first version in
favor of the second on the grounds that the second conforms with another hadith: “You are the
first; there is nothing before You.” [He held that the implication was that created things always
existed along with Allah] .
Hafiz Ibn Hajr remarked concerning the correct manner of reconciling the apparent contradiction
in the above-mentioned hadiths:
“In fact the way to reconcile the two versions of the hadith is to understand the second in light of
the first, and not the other way around. Moreover, there is consensus on the principle that
reconciliation of two apparently contradictory versions of a text (nass) takes precedence over
endorsing one version at the expense of revoking the other. ”
Actually, Ibn Taimáyah’s prejudice blinded him from understanding the two versions of the
hadith which, in fact, are not mutually contradictory. That is because the version “Allah existed
and there was nothing before Him.” has the meaning which is contained in His name the First;
whereas, the version “Allah existed and there was nothing other than Him.” has the meaning
contained in His name the One. The proof of this is still another version of the hadith with the
wording “Allah existed before everything. ”
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#9 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis say Allah has 'Two Real Eyes'
Sh. al-Uthaimeen RH says in
‫عقيدة أهل السنة والجماعة‬

al-Uthaimeen said:
‫ونؤمـن بأن ل تعالى عينين اثنتين حقيقيتين‬
We believe that Allah possesses two real eyes
The author is trying to establish an attribute of TWO REAL eyes for Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala.
Ibn Hazm stated in Al-Fisal fil-Milal (2:166):
"Saying: 'He has two eyes' is null and void and part of the belief of the anthropomorphists...
Allah[subhanahu wa ta'ala] said àyn (literally: 'eye') and a`yunin (literally 'eyes')... so it is not
permissible for anyone to describe Him as possessing 'two eyes' because no text has reached us
to that effect."
Just to elaborate on Ibn Hazm's words:
The Qur'an states àyni (literally: "My Eye") (see 20:39) in the singular and (literally: "Our
Eyes") (see 52:48, 54:14) in the plural but never two eyes in the dual and nothing about 'two real
eyes'.
Quote
{ ‫} فاصبر لحكم ربك فإنك بأعيننا‬
“So wait patiently (O Muhammad) for the Decision of your Lord, for verily, you are under Our
Eyes.” [Soorah at-Toor: 58]
{ ‫ تجري بأعيننا جزاء لمن كان كفر‬. ‫} وحملناه على ذات ألواح ودسر‬
“And We carried him on a (ship) made of planks and nails, Floating under Our Eyes, a reward
for him who had been rejected!” [Al-Qamar: 13-14]
{ ‫} وألقيت عليك محبة مني ولتصنع على عيني‬
“And I endued you with love from Me, in order that you may be brought up under My Eye.”
[TaaHaa: 39]
Some of the narrations from our Nabi salallahu alayhi wa sallam brought by some in their
support for their belief:
"The Antichrist (al-dajjal) is A'war (one-eyed) whereas your Lord is not A'war (one-eyed)"
[Narrated from Ibn Ùmar in al-Bukhari, Muslim, and the Sunan]
Ibn al Jawzi in Akhbar al-Sifat said (point 40):
“In the same category are the following verses: ‘…In order that you might be reared under My
(watchful) eyes.’ And ‘build an ark under Our eyes.’ The expression ‘Under Our eyes’ is taken
by (some) exegetes to mean ‘under our command’ (amr)’, and by others to mean ‘under Our
oversight (mar’an minna).’ Abu Bakr b. al-Anbari pointed out that among the Arabs the plural
(pronoun) is sometimes used even when the referent is singular; hence, one may say: ‘We
travelled to Basra (when one really means ‘I travelled to Basra’).’ This use of the plural derives
from the practice of kings who are in the habit of saying ‘our command’ or ‘our prohibition.’ The
Qadi (Abu Ya’la) maintained that ‘eye’ is an attribute added to the divine essence (za’ida ala dh-
dhat). Already before him Abu Bakr b. Khuzayma said, in connection with the above verses:
‘Our Lord has two eyes by which He sees.” Ibn Hamid said: ‘We must believe that God has two
eyes.’ This view, however, is an innovation for which there is no justification in scripture.
(Champions of this view) attribute two eyes to God only through a kind of inferential reason
(Dalil al-Khitab) based on the Prophet’s (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) statement: ‘He is not one
eyed.’ These words, however, were meant only to deny that imperfection of any sort can be
ascribed to God….”
In points 217-219, ibn al Jawzi said:
In the Sahihs of Bukhari and Muslim there is a tradition from Anas b. Malik in which it is
reported that the Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) said while discussing (the signs of) the
Antichrist (dajjal): “He will have one eye (a’war), but your Lord is not one-eyed.”
The Ulama maintain that the chief aim of this saying is to assert that God cannot be
described in any way that might imply imperfection, for being one-eyed is obviously an
indication of imperfection. The Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) did not mean to
ascribe to God bodily organs, for there is nothing praiseworthy in the attribution of such to
God.
Ibn Àqil said: “The ill informed sometimes assume that since (the Prophet) denied that God is
one eyed He meant to establish by a kind of inferential reason (dalil al-khitab) that God has two
eyes. This is a serious misunderstanding (of the saying), for by denying that God is one-eyed (the
Prophet) merely intended to negate (the possibility of) imperfection in Him….
Coming on to the next narration I have seen some give as "proof", inshaAllah:
As ‘Ataa’ has narrated from Aboo Hurayrah (ra) from the Prophet (sallAllaahu alayhi wa sallam)
said, ‘When the slave stands in Prayer, he stands between the Two Eyes of ar- Rahmaan…’”
(Narrated by Ibn al-Qayyim in As-Sawaa’iq Al-Mursalah (256))
This is probably the weakest of dalils.
First off if we take the hadith literally, would it mean that there is a big gap between Allah’s two
eyes?
More importantly the sanad for that tradition has been declared weak by the scholars that the
salafiyya refer to: Naasir ad-Deen Al-Albaanee said in As-Silsilah Al-Dha’eefah (1024),
“Dha’eef Jiddan”. Also narrated by Al-‘Uqaylee in Al-Dhu’afaa’ (pg. 24), and Al-Bazzaar in his
Musnad (553 – Kashf Al-Astaar). And Ibn al-‘Uthaymeen also declared it Dha’eef in his long
Sharh to Al-‘Aqeedah Al-Waasitiyyah (1/313-314).
Next is the narration of Abu Hurayra that “The Prophet salallahu alayhi wa sallam recited the
verse "Lo! Allāh commands you that you restore deposits to their owners, and, if you judge
between mankind, that you judge justly. Lo! excellent is this which Allāh admonishes you. Lo!
Allāh is ever Hearer, Seer" (4:58) whereupon he sallallahu alayhi wa sallam placed his thumb on
his ear and his index finger on his eye.”
Abu Iyad al-Salafi & Dawud Burbank state in their reference to this very Hadith:
19 Abu Daawood (3/1324) and it is saheeh
Indeed the hadith is narrated by Abu Dawud, and Ibn Hibban (1:498 #265) with a sound chain,
also from his shaykh Ibn Khuzayma in al-Tawhid, al-Hakim (1:24), al-Lalika’i in Sharh I‘tiqad
Ahl al-Sunna (3:410 #788) and al-Bayhaqi in al-Asma’ wal-Sifat.
Yet, where has the Prophet salallahu alayhi wa sallam said that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala has
TWO eyes?
As I said the Hadith is cited by Ibn Hibban.
What follows is his own commentary (see: 1:498 #265):
Ibn Hibban says:
"By placing his fingers on his ear and eye the Prophet [salallahu alayhi wa sallam] wanted to let
people know that Allah Almighty does not hear by means of the ear that has an auditory meatus
and curves, nor does He see with the eye that has eyelids, a pupil, and a white part. Highly
exalted is our Lord above any likeness with His creatures in any way whatsoever! Rather, He
hears and sees without organ (āla) in any way He wishes."
Imam Al-Bayhaqi said of the same hadīth in Al-Asma’ wal-Sifat (Hashidi ed. 1:462-463):
What is meant by the gesture narrated in this report is the verification that Allāh is described as
possessing hearing and sight. He therefore pointed to the two places of hearing and sight in us to
affirm that Allah possesses the Attributes of hearing and sight.
We can go on and on quoting scholars but what is the point when there is no decisive evidence?
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#10 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis say Allah is Surrounding the World
Says Sh. al-Albani:
sh. al-Albani said:

‫ ه‍ـ ما نصه‬1406 ‫ ( من طبعة المكتب السلمي الثانية‬116 / 1 ) ‫ قال في تعليقه على صحيح الترغيب والترهيب‬:
‫ فإن ال قبل وجهه‬: ‫ اعلم أن قوله في هذا الحديث‬: ‫ فائدة هامة‬.
‫ فوق مخلوقاته كلها كما تواترت فيه‬، ‫وفي الحديث الذي قبله فإن ال عز وجل بين أيديكم في صلتكم ل ينافي كونه تعالى على عرشه‬
‫ فإنه تعالى مع ذلك واسع محيط‬، ‫ ورزقنا القتداء بهم‬، ‫ وآثار الصحابة والسلف الصالح رضي ال عنهم‬، ‫نصوص الكتاب والسنة‬
‫ فإن كل خط يخرج من‬، ‫ بل هذا شأن مخلوقه المحيط بما دونه‬، ‫بالعالم وقد أخبر أنه حيثما توجه العبد فإنه مستقبل وجه ال عزوجل‬
‫ فإنه يستقبل وجه المحيط ويواجهه‬، ‫ المركز إلى المحيط‬.
‫ وهو‬، ‫ فكيف بشأن من هو بكل شئ محيط‬، ‫وإذا كان عالي المخلوقات يستقبل سافلها المحاط بها بوجهه من جميع الجهات والجوانب‬
‫محيط ول يحاط به ؟ وراجع بسط هذا في كتب شيخ السلم ابن تيمية كالحموية والواسطية وشرحها للشيخ = ) * ( زيد بن عبد‬
213 - 203 ‫) العزيز بن فياض ) ص‬
rough translation:
He said in his footnotes on Sahih at-Targhib wat-tarhib, from the 1406 Hijri edition of al-Maktab
al-Islami ath-thani, and I quote,
'Important (point of) benefit: know that his statement in this hadith, 'Allah is in front of his face,'
and in the previous hadith, 'Allah Azza wa jalla is in front of you during your Salat,' does not
negate His being on/above the throne (and) above all of his creations, as the text of the Qur'an
and the Sunnah, and the reports of the Companions and Pious Predecessors report by tawatur
(may Allah be pleased with them and may He grant that we follow them). Despite that, Allah is
expansive and encompasses the world, and has informed us that wherever the slave faces, he is
facing the Face of Allah (azza wa jalla). In fact, this is even the state of that of His creation
which surrounds something other than itself as all lines that come from the center towards what it
is surrounded by face the surrounding object. So if a creation high up faces what it is lower than
and is surrounded by, with its surface, from all directions and sides, then what about the One that
surrounds everything, and He is surrounding and not surrounded?
See the detail of this in books of Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah and like Al-Hamawiyah and al-
Wasitiyah and its sharh by Shaykh Zayd Bin Abdul Aziz Bin Fayyad (p. 203 - 213)
This is something similar to what I noticed from someone called sh. Haitham Hamdan who is an
administrator of the multaqa ahl al-hadeeth forums:
Quote
1) Allah SWT could be either inside the world or outside the world ... It is a matter of agreement
among main stream Muslims that He is outside the world. Being inside the world means that He
SWT mixes with impurities, an aspect of imperfection.
2) The universe is round (sperical).
3) Relative to itself, a sperical shape can only have two directions: a top and a bottom.
4) For a sperical shape, bottom is towards its center, above is away from its center.
5) Allah SWT is certainly away from the center of the world, so He is certainly above it.
and a diagram also posted on the same forum:
Um_Abdullah__s___above__.jpg (27.42K)
Number of downloads: 88
Anyhow, al-Albani is saying that the world is physically surrounded or encompassed by Allah,
implying that the world is physically inside of Him practically likening Him to a pregnant
woman!
For plenty of quotes from the salaf and khalaf denying that Allah is in any direction or place
click on this link. Here I will just add one for now:
Imam al-Hafidh al-Bayhaqi said in his book, Al-Asma' was-Sifat, on page 400 [Kawthari
edition]:
،‫ وأن العبد أينما كان فهو في القرب والبعد من ال تعالى سواء‬،‫والذي روي في ّاخر هذا الحديث إشارة إلى نفي المكان عن ال تعالى‬
‫ واستدل بعض أصحابنا في نفي المكان عنه بقول النبي‬.‫ الباطن فل يصح إدراكه بالكون في مكان‬،‫وأنه الظاهر فيصح إدراكه بالدلة‬
‫ وإذا لم يكن فوقه شىء ول دونه شىء لم يكن في‬،‫ وأنت الباطن فليس دونك شىء‬،‫صّلى ال عليه و سّلم أنت الظاهر فليس فوقك شىء‬
‫مكان‬
".... What was mentioned towards the end of the hadith is an indication of denying Allah has a
place and denying the slave is alike to Allah, wherever he was, in proximity or remoteness.
Allah, the Exalted, is adh-Dhahir--hence, it is valid to know about Him by proofs. Allah is al-
Batin--hence, it is invalid that He would be in a place."
He also said:
"Some of our companions used as a proof to refute the place to Allah the saying of the Prophet,
sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam : 'You are adh-Dhahir and there is nothing above You, and You are
al-Batin and there is nothing underneath You.' Therefore, if there is nothing above Him and
nothing underneath Him, He is not in a place."
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#11 IrfanibnIsmail
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Posted 18 September 2008 - 07:48 AM
Salafis say Allah has 'Fingers'
Muhammed Ibn Abdul Wahab an najdi, the founder of wahhabism said:
Quote
The agreement between the Scripture of the Jews and Islam, in that they both confirm that Allah
has Fingers, though they are unlike our fingers and exactly how they are is unknown to us.
(ibn abdul wahab- kitab at tawhid_chapter 64- Translated by Sameh Strauch
Published by International Islamic Publishing House)
Muhiyudeen Shaikh Abd Al Qadir Al Jilani al Hanabali (rahimahullah) in his Kitab sirr al
Asrar wa Mazhar al Anwar said:
" Our Master the Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wassallam) said, ' The hearts of the children of Adam
are between the two fingers of the All-Merciful. He turns them whichever way He wills.'
The two fingers of Allah are His attributes of the irresistible power of punishment and the
loving and delicate beauty of the beneficence. "
(chapter 14, interpreted/translated by Shaykh Tosun Bayrak al-Jerrahi al-Halveti)

(get the book from here: http://www.al-baz.co...ks_page4.shtml)
This post has been edited by faqir: 25 May 2009 - 12:15 PM
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#12 faqir
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Posted 03 January 2009 - 01:23 PM
Bismillah..
Salafis say Allah has a Shadow
Says Sh. Ibn Baz [may Allah have mercy on him]:

Quote
http://www.binbaz.org.sa/mat/4234
‫مسألة في الصفات‬
‫ل؟‬
ً ‫ فهل يوصف ال تعالى بأن له ظ‬،‫في حديث السبعة الذين يظلهم ال في ظله يوم ل ظل إل ظله‬
‫ فهو له ظل يليق به سبحانه ل‬،((‫[ لكن الصحيحين ))في ظله‬1]((‫ ))في ظل عرشه‬:‫ وفي بعض الروايات‬،‫نعم كما جاء في الحديث‬
‫ وال ولي التوفيق‬.‫ الباب واحد عند أهل السنة والجماعة‬،‫نعلم كيفيته مثل سائر الصفات‬.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[1] ‫ باب فضل‬،‫ ومسلم في كتاب الزكاة‬،660 ‫ برقم‬،‫ باب من جلس في المسجد ينتظر الصلة‬،‫أخرجه البخاري في كتاب الذان‬
1031 ‫ برقم‬،‫إخفاء الصدقة‬.
‫مجموع فتاوى ومقالت متنوعة المجلد الثامن والعشرون‬
Rough Translation:
Issue relating to the Attributes [of Allah]:
In the hadith of the seven of those who will be shaded by Allah in His shadow on the day that there is
no shadow save His shadow, is this attributing Allah the Exalted with a shadow?
Answer:
Yes, as is reported in the Hadith and in some transmissions : "in the shadow of His throne". But, in
the Sahihayn it is : "in His shadow" for He has a shadow that is befitting to Him, the Glorious,
and we do not know its modality (Kayf) just like the rest of His attributes...
Shaykh Gibril commented:
Even in the compilations usually adduced by the anthropomorphists - let alone the commentaries
of the impeccable Ahl al-Sunna - the hadiths mentioning the words "in His shade" (al-Bukhari,
Muslim, Muwatta') are understood in the context of the hadiths mentioning "in the shade of His
Throne" (al-Tirmidhi, Ahmad and others). No one to my knowledge has claimed such a Divine
attribute as "the shade" even among those who did their best to gather all the attributes from a
literalist perspective such as Ibn Khuzayma, al-Harawi al-Ansari, and Abu Ya`la.
Thus Ibn Mandah in al-Tawhid has a chapter entitled "Another exposition showing that the
shade of the Throne is used to shade whomever Allah wishes among His servants" which he
begins by mentioning the hadith "in the shade of His Throne" then he follows it up with the
hadith "in His shade."
Similarly Ibn Hibban in his Sahih has a section-title mentioning "the shade of His Throne" but
the only hadith in that section has the wording "His shade."
Similarly, Qadi Ìyad in Sharh Sahih Muslim explains "His shade" as a possessive adjective of
possession (milk) and that what is meant here is the shade of the Throne, to which Ibn Hajar in
Fath al-Bari adds: "and honor (tashrif)," adding that he considers its explanation as "the shade of
His Throne" preponderant in light of the narration mentioning it explicitly.
Ibn Rajab in his own Fath al-Bari also said "What is meant by 'His shade' is the shade of His
Throne" in light of the hadiths mentioning the latter explicitly.
It is true, as Ibn Baz said, that the hadiths mentioning "His shade" are in the two Sahihs, contrary
to the hadiths mentioning "the shade of His Throne." What he missed, however, is that the latter
as a whole are even more authentic since, as al-Dhahabi said in al-Ùluw, they are mass-
transmitted.
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#13 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
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Posted 15 February 2009 - 11:34 PM
Salafis say Allah performs Jogging / Trotting
An interesting quote I saw on-line - it would be useful if someone who has the book could
confirm it:
In Fatawa al-Aqida by Muhammad b. Salih b. Uthaimin, page 112, he says:

Quote
‫وأي مانع يمنع من أن نؤمن بأن ال تعالى يأتي هرولة‬
"What could forbid us from believing that Allah performs jogging/trotting [harwala]?" [!!!]
Compare that to what is quoted from al-Khattabi:
Allah Almighty is not described by movement, since movement and stillness follow one after the
other in the same entity: it is specifically possible to attribute movement to whatever can be
attributed stillness, and both of them are among the accidents of originated matter (min a`rad al-
hadath) and the attributes of creatures. Whereas Allah is exalted high above them, {There is
nothing whatsoever like unto Him.} (42:11)
Shaykh Gibril also said regarding the hadith: "If My servant comes near Me one hand-span I
come near him one cubit. If he comes near Me one cubit I come near him an arm's length. If he
comes to Me walking, I come to him running." In al-Bukhari, Muslim and others.
Imam al-Tirmidhi said in his Sunan: "It is narrated from al-A`mash regarding the explanation
of this hadith, 'Whosoever comes near Me one cubit I come near him an arm's length,' that it
means with forgiveness and mercy. Thus did some of the people of learning explain it. They
said: Its meaning is only that He says, 'If the servant draws near Me by obeying Me and doing
what I commanded, I am very swift to draw near him with My forgiveness and My mercy.'"
‫ب ِمّني‬ َ ‫ن َتَقّر‬ْ ‫ث َم‬ِ ‫حِدي‬ َ ‫سيِر َهَذا اْل‬ ِ ‫ش ِفي َتْف‬ِ ‫عَم‬ْ‫ل‬ َْ ‫ن ا‬
ْ‫ع‬ َ ‫َوُيْرَوى‬
‫عا‬ً ‫ت ِمْنُه ِذَرا‬ُ ‫شْبًرا َتقَّرْب‬ِ
‫ل اْلِعْلِم‬ِ ‫ض َأْه‬
ُ ‫سَر َبْع‬ ّ ‫حَمِة َوَهَكَذا َف‬ ْ ‫َيْعِني ِباْلَمْغِفَرِة َوالّر‬
‫ث َقاُلوا ِإّنَما‬َ ‫حِدي‬َ ‫َهَذا اْل‬
ُ ‫عِتي َوَما َأَمْر‬
‫ت‬ َ ‫طا‬َ ‫ي اْلَعْبُد ِب‬
ّ ‫ب ِإَل‬
َ ‫ل ِإَذا َتَقّر‬
ُ ‫َمْعَناُه َيُقو‬
‫حَمِتي‬ ْ ‫ع ِإَلْيِه ِبَمغِْفَرِتي َوَر‬ُ ‫سِر‬ْ ‫ُأ‬
"Qatada said: 'Allah is fastest in forgiving.... What is meant is to express the swiftness of the
response and forgiveness of Allah, as we narrated from Qatada." Al-Bayhaqi, al-Asma' wal-Sifat
(Kawthari ed. p. 285-286; Hashidi ed. 2:51-54).
"He did not mean by this hadith a coming-near in terms of distance, for such is impossible and
inexistent. All he meant was the servant's coming-near in terms of good works, and the coming-
near of Allah in terms of answer and acceptance." Al-Baji, al-Muntaqa (1:357)
"The meaning of His coming closer to us by descending to the nearest heaven, or by His
drawing-near a cubit and an arm's length, is that He treats us with munificence (ikram) in the
manner of the liege-lord that walks towards his servants and condescends to them, turning to
them with full attention (muqbilan àlayhim) and examining their needs one by one." Ibn Àbd
al-Salam, al-Ishara ila al-Ijaz (p. 106).
"This hadith is among the narrations of the Divine Attributes and it is impossible take it in its
outward meaning. We already spoke many times about the hadiths on the Divine Attributes. Its
meaning is, 'Whoever comes near Me with obedience to Me, I come near him with My mercy
and success, and help, and if he does more, I do more. If he comes walking and hastens to obey
Me, I come running, that is, I pour mercy over him and overtake him so that I do not make him
need to walk much in order to attain his goal.' The message is that his reward is many times over
proportional to his coming near." Al-Nawawi, Sharh Sahih Muslim (17:3-4).
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#14 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
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Posted 24 May 2009 - 11:22 PM
Salafis say Allah has a 'Form'
Abd Allah al-Hashidi the "Salafi" editor of al-Bayhaqi's al-Asma' wal-Sifat (2:60) openly
attributes form and shape to Allah Most High:
Quote
"As for our Lord, we affirm that He possesses a form (sura)"
and (2:67)
Quote
"As for us we affirm a form (sura) for Allah unlike forms."
Similarly, the Egyptian 'Salafi' scholar Mohammed Khalil Harras......
‫ محمد خليل هّراس‬،‫ المحّقق‬،‫ي‬ّ ‫ السلف‬،‫لمة‬

ّ ‫هو الع‬
‫ أفنى حياته في التعليم والتأليف ونشر السنة وعقيدة أهل السنة‬،‫جة والبيان‬
ّ ‫ي الح‬
ّ ‫ قو‬،‫ق‬
ّ ‫ شديًدا في الح‬،‫كان رحمه ال سلفي المعتقد‬
‫والجماعة‬
....who salafis describe as:
"He was Salafi in creed, stern in establishing the truth, persuasive in establishing his proof, he
spent his life teaching, authoring, and spreading the creed of Ahlus Sunnah wal Jama'a"
says on p. 39 of his commentary on "At-Tawhid" by Ibn Khuzayma:

Quote
‫فالصورة ل تضاف إلى ال كإضافة خلقه إليه لنها وصف قائم به‬
"So 'Image' is not attributed to Allah the way his creation is attributed to Him, because it (His
image), is an attribute which subsists in His essence"
and on pg. 156:

Quote
‫ وقد عاد لنا في صورته التي رأيناه فيها أول مرة فيقول أنا ربكم‬، ‫ثم تبدى ال لنا بصورة غير صورته التي رأيناه فيها أول مرة‬
"Then he appeared to us with an image which is different then what we have previously seen,
and He returned to us in the image we first saw him in and says: 'I am your Lord' "
Meanwhile scholars of Ahl al-Sunna like Ibn Àbd al-Salam in his Mulha state:
"He is not a body endowed with form."
Similarly Ibn al-Jawzi in Daf` Shubahi al-Tashbih (al-Kawthari ed. 1998 repr. p. 35) states:
"Know that it is obligatory upon every Muslim to firmly hold that it is impermissible to attribute
to Allah Most High form (sura), which consists in physiognomy (hay'a) and features (ta'lif)."
Imam al Khattabi said:
What is upon us and all Muslims to believe is that our Lord does not possess a sura (image) or
hay'a (form), for an image implies a modality (kayfiya) and that is negated from both Allah and
His attributes.
‫ هـ( فيما رواه عنه الحافظ البيهقي في ]السماء والصفات[ ما نصه‬388 ‫قال المام أبو سليمان الخطابي )ت‬:
"‫ فإن الصورة تقتضي الكيفية وهي عن ال وعن‬،‫إن الذي يجب علينا وعلى كل مسلم أن يعلمه أن ربنا ليس بذي صورة ول هيئة‬
‫صفاته منفية" اهـ‬
Al-Subkī said: Al-Ash'arī and most of the Scholars of kalām have declared as disbelievers any
innovator whose innovation constitutes or leads to disbelief. For example, if he claims that the
object of his worship possess an image (sūra), or a limit (hadd) and boundary (nihāya), or that it
is permissible to attribute to him movement and stillness. [Cited in al-Kawtharī, Maqālāt (p.
374)]
Click on this link for further information
[translations and quotes courtesy of sidi Hatim and sh. Gibril]

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#15 faqir
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Posted 25 May 2009 - 10:50 PM
Salafis Say, Allah has ShinS
Muhammad Taqi Al-Din Al-Hilali and Muhammad Muhsin Khan in 'Interpretation of the
Meanings of the Noble Qur’an' - the official Wahhabi translation of the Qur’an in the English
language - say:
Quote
All that has been revealed in Allah’s Book as regards the Qualities of Allah, the Most High, like
His Face, Eyes, Hands, Shins (Legs) , His Coming, His rising over His Throne and others, of all
the Allah’s Messenger qualified Him in the true authentic [sic] Prophet’s [Hadith] as regards His
Qualities like His Descent or His Laughing and others, the religious scholars of the Qur’an and
Sunna believe in these Qualities of Allah and they confirm that these are really His Qualities,
without Ta’wil (interpreting their meanings into different things) or Tashbih (giving resemblance
or similarity to any of the creatures) or Ta`ţil (i.e. completely ignoring or denying them, i.e. there
is no Face, or Eyes, or Hands, or Shins for Allah).
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Salafi Creed Vs Sunni Creed [aqida]
#1 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
• Posts: 2,488
Posted 31 May 2008 - 11:24 AM
Bismillah.
Salafis On Allah's 'Highness' and Fir'awn :

Sh. Ibn Taymiyya said:
Ibn Taymiyya said:

Allah's Names and Attributes in the Qur'an
[....]
Highness:
[....]
And He has said:
"O Haman! Build me a tower, that I may reach the roads, - the roads of heavens, and that I may
climb up to the God of Moses, though verily I think he [Moses] is a liar." (Ghafir 40/36-37)
Al-Aqidah al-Wasitiyya
http://islamicweb.co.../taimiyah_5.htm
http://www.al-eman.c...toc.asp?BID=275
Sh. Salih Al-Fawzan states in his explanation of the waasitiyyah, as translated by “Aboo
Waheeda As-Salafee”:
Quote
“In it is affirmation of the ‘uluww (highness) of Allah over his creations. Such that Prophet Musa
(’alayhis salaam) affirmed this and called to it. And then Fir’awn denied this.”
Qadi Abu Bakr ibn al-Arabi said:
[...] They (i.e. the anthropomorphists) say: All the firm believers in the oneness of Allah
raise their hands to the heavens when supplicating him, and if Musa had not said to
Pharaoh: “My Lord is in the Heaven.” Pharoah would not have said: “Oh Haamaan! Build
for me a lofty tower in order that I may survey the god of Moses!” (28:38)
We say: “You are lying about Musaa (’alayhis salaam), he never stated such! However,
your conclusion shows that you are indeed the followers of Fir’awn, who believed that the
Creator lies in directions, and thus he desired to climb up to Him on a ladder. He
congratulates you for being of his followers, and he is certainly your Imam!”
http://www.sunnah.or...%20Descent2.htm
Refer also to:
http://seekingilm.co...es/271#more-271
And from the tafsir of Imâm al-Tabarânî from his Tafsîr al-Kabîr under [28:38]:
،‫سعًا مرتفعًا‬
ِ ‫طويلً مّت‬ َ ‫صرًا‬ ْ ‫صْرحًا {؛ أي َق‬ َ ‫جَعل ّلي‬ْ ‫ } َفٱ‬،‫جّرا‬ُ ‫خْذ ِلي آ‬ ِ ‫ن {؛ أي اّت‬ِ ‫طي‬
ّ ‫عَلى ٱل‬َ ‫ن‬
ُ ‫ } َفَأْوِقْد ِلي ٰيَهاَما‬:‫وقولُه تعالى‬
ً‫سمًا مشاَهدا‬ْ‫ج‬
ِ ‫سى‬ َ ‫ن أن إلَه ُمو‬ ّ ‫ وظ‬،‫سماِء‬ّ ‫ن يبُلَغ بصرحِه إلى ال‬
ْ ‫ن بجهلِه أنه َيَتَهّيُأ له أ‬
ّ‫ظ‬َ ،‫س ٰى {؛ أي أصعُد إليه‬ َ ‫طِلُع ِإَل ٰى ِإَل ٰـِه ُمو‬ ۤ ّ‫} ّلَع‬
ّ ‫لي َأ‬
َ ‫ن ذِل‬
‫ك‬ ْ‫ع‬
َ ‫ل‬ُ ‫ َتَعاَلى ا‬،‫شبَهُة‬
َ ‫ل اْلُم‬
ُ ‫كما تقو‬.
Pharaoh thought in his ignorance that by his tower he would be able to reach to the Sky, and
thought that the God of Musa is a body that can be looked at, just as the anthropomorphists say.
Allah is greatly clear of and above that.
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#2 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:26 PM
Bismillah.
Salafis say al-Istawa' means Istiqrar / Settlement upon the Arsh
Says Sh. Ibn Uthaimeen regarding istawa:
al-Uthaimeen said:
‫ونحن نعلم معنى الستواء ونؤمن به ونقره وهو أنه سبحانه وتعالى عل عرشه واستوى عليه علوا واستقرارا يليق به‬
‫سبحانه وتعالى ولكننا ل نعلم كيفية هذا الستواء‬
‫‪rough translation:‬‬
‫‪We know the meaning of istawa and we believe it and and accept/approve it and He subhanahu‬‬
‫‪wa ta'ala is upon is His arsh and His establishment thereupon is of aboveness and settledness‬‬
‫‪(istiqrar) Glorified and Exalted be He. We don't know the modality of this al-istawa'.‬‬
‫‪http://www.ibnothaim...ticle_793.shtml‬‬
‫‪Imam Abu Hanifa in Wasiyya al-Imam al-A‘zam ila Abi ‘Amr ‘Uthman al-Batti (p. 10).‬‬
‫‪“We assert that Allah established Himself over the throne without His need (hâja) nor‬‬
‫‪settlement (istiqrâr) upon it, for He it is Who preserves the Throne and other than it without‬‬
‫”‪needing any of them.‬‬
‫‪From al-Hafiz ibn Hajar al Asqalani's Fath al-Bari:‬‬
‫قوله )وقال مجاهد استوى‪ :‬عل على العرش( وصله الفريابي عن ورقاء عن ابن أبي نجيح عنه قال ابن بطال اختلف الناس في‬
‫الستواء المذكور هنا فقالت المعتزلة معناه الستيلء بالقهر والغلبة واحتجوا بقول الشاعر‪ :‬قد استوى بشر على العراق من غير ودم‬
‫مهراق وقالت الجسمية معناه الستقرار‬
‫‪Here is a translation of part of what is mentioned above:‬‬
‫‪The Mu`tazila said its meaning is "establishing dominion through subjugation and‬‬
‫‪overpowering" (al-istila' bi al-qahr wa al-ghalaba), citing as a proof the saying of the poet: Bishr‬‬
‫‪established mastery over Iraq without sword and without shedding blood.‬‬
‫"‪The anthropomorphists (al-jismiyya) said: "Its meaning is settledness (al-istiqrar).‬‬
‫‪This meaning was also rejected by Imam al-Izz Ibn Abdas Salaam:‬‬
‫قال الشيخ عز الدين بن عبد السلم رحمه ال ورضي عنه وعّنا به الحمد ل ذي العزة والجلل والقدرة والكمال والنعام والفضال‬
‫الواحد الحد الفرُد الصمد الذي لم يلد ولم يولد ولم يكن له كفوا أحد ليس بجسم مصّور ول جوهٍر محدوٍد مقدر ول يشبه شيئا ول‬
‫يشبهه شيٌء ول تحيط به الجهات ول تكتنفه الرضون ول السموات كان قبل أن كّون المكان ودّبر الزمان وهو الن على ما عليه‬
‫ن(‬ ‫ل عّما َيْفَعلُ َوُهْم ُيسَئُلو َ‬
‫ل )ل ُيسَئ ُ‬‫ل نقمة منه فهي عد ٌ‬ ‫ل وك ّ‬
‫ل نعمة منه فهي فض ٌ‬ ‫كان خَلق الخلق وأعمالهم وقّدر أرزاقهم وآجالهم فك ّ‬
‫سة والستقرار والتمّكن والحلول‬ ‫استوى على العرش المجيد على الوجه الذي قاله وبالمعنى الذي أراده استواء منزها عن المما ّ‬
‫ش وحمَلُته محمولون بلطف قدرته‬ ‫ش بل العر ُ‬
‫والنتقال فتعالى ال الكبير المتعال عما يقوله أهل الغي والضلل بل ل يحمله العر ُ‬
‫ي مريٌد سميٌع‬ ‫طلٌع على هواجس الضمائر وحركات الخواطر ح ّ‬ ‫ل شيء عددا م ّ‬ ‫علما وأحصى ك ّ‬ ‫ل شيٍء ِ‬ ‫مقهورون في قبضته أحاط بك ّ‬
‫ف ول صوت ول ُيتصّور في كلمه أن ينقلب ِمدادًا في اللواح والوراق شكل‬ ‫ي ليس بحر ٍ‬ ‫بصيٌر عليٌم قديٌر متكلم بكلٍم قديم أزل ّ‬
‫ترُمقه العيون والحداق كما زعم أهل الحشو والّنفاق بل الكتابة من أفعال العباد ول ُيتصّور في أفعالهم أن تكون قديمة ويجب‬
‫ل عليه وانتسب إليه أن ُيعتقد عظمته وترعى‬ ‫ق لما د ّ‬
‫حّ‬‫احترامها لدللتها على كلمه كما يجب احترام أسمائه لدللتها على ذاته و ُ‬
‫صلحاء‬‫حرمته ولذلك يجب احترام الكعبة والنبياء والُعباد وال ّ‬
Here is a short translation [Shaykh GF Haddad]:
What Allah Is Not
He is not a body endowed with form. He is not a substance confined by boundary or

measurement. He resembles nothing and nothing resembles Him. Directions and sides do not
encompass Him. Neither the earths nor the heavens contain Him.
His Preternity (Beginninglessness)
He was before He brought place and time into existence, and He is now as He ever was. (1)
His Acts
He created creatures as well as their actions. He decreed the extent of their sustenance and the
term of their lives. Every benefit from Him is from His favor, and every punishment is from His
justice. (He will not be questioned as to what He does, but they will be questioned. (21:23)
He established Himself over the glorious Throne in the way that He says and the meaning
He intends, “established” in a manner transcending contact (mumâssa), settledness
(istiqrâr), fixity (tamakkun), indwelling (hulûl), or movement (intiqâl). (2)
Exalted is Allah the Greatest, the Most High, far above the claims of the people of error and
misguidance! Never can the Throne carry Him, rather the Throne and the Throne-Bearers are
carried up by the subtlety of His infinite might, and all are powerless (maqhûrûn) in His grasp.
(3)
---------------------------
The footnotes to the above also contain some important quotes:
Footnotes for the above:
(1)- Cf. hadith of the Prophet ρ : kâna allâhu wa lâ shay’a ma‘ahu / ghayruhu / qablahu – “Allah
existed and nothing existed together with Him / other than Him / before Him.” Narrated from
Burayda by al-Hakim in al-Mustadrak (2:341), who declared it sound (sahîh) – al-Dhahabi
concurred – and from ‘Imran ibn Husayn by Bukhari, Ibn Hibban with two sound chains in his
Sahih (14:7 #6140, 14:11 #6142), and Ibn Abi Shayba in his Musannaf. See Appendix, “Allah is
now as He ever was.”
(2) See the appendix entitled “Istiwâ’ is a Divine Act” in the translation of Bayhaqi’s al-Asma’
wa al-Sifat, published separately. Note that the “Salafis” deny most of the above: “ The ‘Salafis’
and Ibn Taymiyya assert that settledness takes place over the Throne…. Ibn Taymiyya
strenuously asserts that Allah descends, and can be above (fawq) and below (taht) ‘without
how’…. and that the school of the Salaf is the affirmation of everything that the Qur’an stated
concerning aboveness (fawqiyya), belowness (tahtiyya), and establishment over the Throne.”
‫‪Abu Zahra, al-Madhahib al-Islamiyya (p. 320-322). Ibn Rushd in Sharh al-‘Utbiyya stated that‬‬
‫‪Malik’s position is: “The Throne is not Allah’s location of settledness (mawdi‘ istiqrâr‬‬
‫‪Allâh).” As quoted in Fath al-Bari (1959 ed. 7:124 #3592).‬‬
‫‪(3) “We assert that Allah established Himself over the throne without His need (hâja) nor‬‬
‫‪settlement (istiqrâr) upon it, for He it is Who preserves the Throne and other than it‬‬
‫‪without needing any of them.” Abu Hanifa, Wasiyya al-Imam al-A‘zam ila Abi ‘Amr ‘Uthman‬‬
‫‪al-Batti (p. 10). “Allah established Himself over the Throne in the sense that He said and the‬‬
‫‪meaning that He wills, with an establishment that transcends touch, settlement, location,‬‬
‫‪immanence, and displacement. The Throne does not carry him, rather the Throne and its carriers‬‬
‫‪are carried by the subtleness of His power, subdued under His grip.” Al-Ash‘ari, al-Ibana ‘an‬‬
‫‪Usul al-Diyana, Mahmud ed. (p. 21); Sabbagh ed. (p. 35),“The carrier of the Throne and of its‬‬
‫‪carriers is in reality Allah Himself.” Abu Sulayman al-Khattabi (d. 386) as quoted in Bayhaqi, al-‬‬
‫‪Asma’ wa al-Sifat (al-Hashidi ed. 2:279-280).‬‬
‫‪Here is how Ibn Hajar quoted Ibn Rushd's saying from Imam Malik:‬‬
‫قال أبو الوليد بن رشد في " شرح العتبية " إنما نهى مالك لئل يسبق إلى وهم الجاهل أن العرش إذا تحرك يتحرك ال بحركته كما‬
‫‪.‬يقع للجالس منا على كرسيه‪ ،‬وليس العرش بموضع استقرار ال‪ ،‬تبارك ال وتنزه عن مشابهة خلقه‬
‫‪And finally, here is Imam al-Bayhaqi on Istiwa and rejection of Istiqrar, in his al-I'tiqad:‬‬
‫ن‪ 56‬أخبرنا علي بن محمد بن عبد‬ ‫حي َ‬

‫سَماِء الّدْنَيا ِ‬
‫ل َلْيَلٍة إَِلى َ‬
‫ل ُك ّ‬
‫جّ‬
‫عّز َو َ‬
‫ل َ‬
‫ل ا ُّ‬
‫سِتَواِء << " َيْنِز ُ‬
‫لْ‬‫ل ِفي ا ِ‬
‫ب اْلَقْو ِ‬
‫ي << َبا ُ‬
‫عِتَقاُد ِلْلَبْيَهِق ّ‬
‫لْ‬
‫اِ‬
‫ال بن بشران ‪ ،‬ثنا أحمد بن سلمان ‪ ،‬قال ‪ :‬قرئ على سليمان بن الشعث ‪ ،‬وأخبرنا أبو علي الروذباري ‪ ،‬أنا أبو بكر بن داسة ‪ ،‬ثنا‬
‫أبو داود ‪ ،‬ثنا القعنبي ‪ ،‬عن مالك ‪ ،‬عن ابن شهاب ‪ ،‬عن أبي سلمة بن عبد الرحمن ‪ ،‬وعن أبي عبد ال الغر ‪ ،‬عن أبي هريرة ‪،‬‬
‫رضي ال عنه ‪ ،‬أن رسول ال صلى ال عليه وسلم قال ‪ " :‬ينزل ال عز وجل كل ليلة إلى سماء الدنيا حين يبقى ثلث الليل الخر‬
‫فيقول ‪ :‬من يدعوني فأستجيب له ‪ ،‬من يسألني فأعطيه ‪ ،‬من يستغفرني فأغفر له " قال رحمه ال ‪ :‬وهذا حديث صحيح رواه جماعة‬
‫من الصحابة عن النبي صلى ال عليه وسلم ‪ ،‬وأصحاب الحديث فيما ورد به الكتاب والسنة من أمثال هذا ‪ ،‬ولم يتكلم أحد من‬
‫الصحابة والتابعين في تأويله ‪ ،‬ثم إنهم على قسمين ‪ :‬منهم من قبله وآمن به ولم يؤوله ووكل علمه إلى ال ونفى الكيفية والتشبيه عنه ‪.‬‬
‫ومنهم من قبله وآمن به وحمله على وجه يصح استعماله في اللغة ول يناقض التوحيد ‪ .‬وقد ذكرنا هاتين الطريقتين في كتاب السماء‬
‫والصفات في المسائل التي تكلموا فيها من هذا الباب ‪ ،‬وفي الجملة يجب أن يعلم أن استواء ال سبحانه وتعالى ليس باستواء اعتدال‬
‫عن اعوجاج ول استقرار في مكان ‪ ،‬ول مماسة لشيء من خلقه ‪ ،‬لكنه مستو على عرشه كما أخبر بل كيف بل أين ‪ ،‬بائن من جميع‬
‫خلقه ‪ ،‬وأن إتيانه ليس بإتيان من مكان إلى مكان ‪ ،‬وأن مجيئه ليس بحركة ‪ ،‬وأن نزوله ليس بنقلة ‪ ،‬وأن نفسه ليس بجسم ‪ ،‬وأن وجهه‬
‫ليس بصورة ‪ ،‬وأن يده ليست بجارحة ‪ ،‬وأن عينه ليست بحدقة ‪ ،‬وإنما هذه أوصاف جاء بها التوقيف ‪ ،‬فقلنا بها ونفينا عنها التكييف ‪،‬‬
‫فقد قال ‪ :‬ليس كمثله شيء ‪ ،‬وقال ‪ :‬ولم يكن له كفوا أحد ‪ ،‬وقال ‪ :‬هل تعلم له سميا‬
‫]‪[arabic quotes courtesy of Sidi Abul Hasan‬‬

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‫‪#3‬‬ ‫‪faqir‬‬
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Bismillah.
Salafis object to declaring Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala transcendent beyond possessing

body, parts and limbs:
Sh. Ibn Baz said:

Sh. Ibn Baz said:
‫أهل السنة ل ينفون عن ال إل ما نفاه عن نفسه‬
9- ‫ تنزيه ال سبحانه عن الجسم والحدقة والصماخ‬- ‫ هداه ال‬- ‫ثم ذكر الصابوني‬
‫ وهذا ليس بمذهب أهل السنة بل هو من أقوال أهل الكلم‬، ‫واللسان والحنجرة‬
‫ فإن أهل السنة ل ينفون عن ال إل ما نفاه عن نفسه أو‬، ‫المذموم وتكلفهم‬
‫نفاه رسوله صلى ال عليه وسلم ول يثبتون له إل ما أثبته لنفسه أو أثبته له‬
‫رسوله صلى ال عليه وسلم ولم يرد في النصوص نفي هذه المور ول إثباتها‬
‫ ويغني عن ذلك قول‬، ‫فالواجب الكف عنها وعدم التعرض لها ل بنفي ول إثبات‬
‫أهل السنة في إثبات صفات ال وأسمائه أنه ل يشابه فيها خلقه وأنه سبحانه ل‬
‫ )ل يوصف ال إل بما وصف به نفسه‬:‫ قال المام أحمد رحمه ال‬.‫ند له ول كفو له‬
‫)أو وصفه به رسوله صلى ال عليه وسلم ل يتجاوز القرآن والحديث‬.
9_ Then As-Sabuni –May Allah guide him- mentioned declaring Allah transcendent beyond
possessing body (al-jism), pupils (al-hadaqa), auditory meatus (al-simâkh), tongue (al-lisân), and
larynx (al-hanjara); [End of Sabuni's words- beginning of Ibn Baz's words] and this is not the
position of Ahl al-Sunna but rather that of the scholars of condemned kalâm and their
contrivance , for Ahl As-sunnah do not negate something about Allah except what He negates
about Hisself or what his Messenger ‫ صلى ال عليه وسلم‬negated, and they do not affirm for Him
(Allah) except what He affirmed for Hisself or what the Messenger of Allah ‫صلى ال عليه وسلم‬
affirmed for Him, and it was not mentioned in the nusoos (the Quran and Sunnah) negation of
these things (that As-Sabuni mentioned) or its affirmation; so it is obligatory to stop there and
not to confront it with neither negation or affirmation, and what Ahl As-sunnah said suffices in
the affirmation of Allah's attributes and names that He does resemble in it his creation, and that
He (glorified be He) has no match. Imam Ahmad [rahimahu Allah] said: "Allah is not to be
described except with what He described Himself with or what His Messenger described Him
with, it does not
exceed the Quran and Hadith".
Compare this statement to what Imam Abu Ja'far at-Tahawi says in point number 38 of his
creedal work:
So what then is the shaykh's opinion of Imam Abu Ja'far at-Tahawi?
Our liegelord Àli ibn Abi Talib, Allah be well-pleased with him is reported by Abu Nuàym in
Hilyat al-Awliya' (1:73) to have said:
"He – glorious and exalted – spoke to Musa directly (takliman) without limbs, without organs,
without lips, and without uvula!"
Similarly, Shah Wali Allah al-Dihlawi said in his al-I`tiqad al-Sahih, printed with Siddiq Hasan
Khan's commentary on the margins of Nu`man al-Alusi's Jala' al-Àynayn:
"He is neither an indivisible substance, nor an accident, nor a body, nor is He spatially bounded,
nor does He possess direction."
Imam al-Kawthari said about Ibn Taymiyya's similar obfuscation:
"These words are complete impudence. What did he do with all the verses declaring Allah
Most High to be far removed from anything like unto Him? Does he expect that the idiocy
that every single idiot can come up with be addressed with a specific text? Is it not enough
that Allah Most High said: {There is nothing whatsoever like Him} (42:11)? Or does he
consider it permissible for someone to say: Allah eats this, chews that, and tastes this, just
because no text mentions the opposite? This is disbelief laid bare and pure
anthropomorphism."
Al-Kawthari, Maqalat (p. 350-353). [latter three quote translations courtesy of sh. Gibril]
Also, in Imam al-Kawthari's ‫ فتن المجسمة وصنوف مخازيهم‬it is mentioned that Imam ‘Abd al-Qāhir
al-Baghdādi mentioned in his book al-Asmā’ wa ’l-Sifāt:
‫إن الشعري وأكثر المتكلمين قالوا بتكفير كل مبتدع كانت بدعته كفرا أو أدت إلى كفر كمن زعم أن لمعبوده صورة أو أن له‬
‫ ول إشكال لذي لب في تكفير الكرامية مجسمة خراسان في قولهم إن ال جسم‬. ‫حدا ونهاية أو أنه يجوز عليه الحركة والسكون‬
‫له حد ونهاية من تحته وإنه مماس لعرشه وإنه محل الحوادث وإنه يحدث فيه قوله وإرادته أهــ‬
Indeed, Abu al-Hasan al-Ash‘ari [(d. 324 / 936; Baghdad) the supreme imam of orthodox
Muslims in the field of beliefs and al-tauhīd], and most experts in orthodox belief and its proof
and defense [al mutakallimun] insisted on the unbelief of every sectarian [mubtadi‘] whose
heresy was in itself outright unbelief, or directly implied unbelief as, for example, whoever held
that what he worshipped had an image [sūrah], or a limit [hadd], or extremity [nihāyah], or that
[what he worshipped] might move or be still. There is no difficulty for anybody who has a mind
to comprehend the unbelief of the Karrāmiyah, the anthropomorphists [al-mujassimah] of
Khurāsān, for claiming that He, the Transcendent, is a body, and has a limit, and an extremity
underneath Him, and that He contacts His throne, and that He is the site of occurrences, and that
speech and will recur to Him again and again, [whereas the truth of the matter is that His speech
and His will are preeternal and one and single].
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#4 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis On Allah possessing limits
Says Sh. Ibn Baz on his 'commentary' on al-Àqida al-Tahawiyya:
Sh. bin Baz said:

‫ فهو سبحانه ل يعلم حدوده إل هو سبحانه‬،‫فمراده بالحدود يعني التي يعلمها البشر‬
By hudood (limits) the author means such as known by humans since no one except Allah
Almighty knows his limits.
see footnote 3: http://www.furqaan.c...muslimcreed.htm
This is, of course, in complete contradiction to what Imam Abu Ja'far al-Tahawi himself says:
By the way, Abu Sa'id ad-Darimi, the author of al-Radd ala Bishr al-Marisi, said, as quoted by
Sh. Ibn Taymiyah in Dar' at-Ta'arud without rebuke (2/28-29):
Ibn Taymiyya said:

The section on the Hadd (limit) and the 'Arsh
Abu Sa'id said:
The opponent also claimed that Allah does not possess a Hadd (limit), Ghayah (restriction), or
Nihayah (end). He said: And this is the basis upon which Jahm (ibn Safwan) built his
misguidnace and derived all of his errors. It has not reached us that anyone besides Jahm in the
world proceeded him with it. Someone who was discussing this with him (Jahm) said to him: I
have come to know your intent oh non-Arab. You intend that Allah is nothing, because all of the
creation have known that there is nothing that is called a "thing" except that it has a Hadd (limit),
a Ghayah (restriction) and an attribute, and that what has no limit, restriction or attribute is
nothingness.
So that which is a "thing" must necessarily be described with attributes. Nothingness is described
with no limit or restriction. Your statement: He has no limit means that He is nothing.
Abu Sa'id said:
Allah Ta'ala has a limit that no one knows but Him and it is not allowed for anyone to imagine a
limit to His limit in himself, however, he is to beleive in the limit and relegate the knolwedge of
that to Allah. His place (Makan) also has a limit and He is upon His 'Arsh above the seven
heavens- so these are two limits.
Sh. Ibn Taymiyya himself said in Muwaafaqat al-Manqul (2:29) (republished as Dar' Ta'aarud al-
Àqli wal-Naql (2:58-59):
Quote
There is agreement one and all among the Muslims and the disbelievers [sic] that Allah Most
High is in the heaven and they ascribed it to Him as a limit except al-Marrisi the misguided and
his friends. Even little boys that have not reached puberty know this: when a boy is sad he raises
his hand to his Lord and calls unto Him in the Heaven and nowhere else. Everybody knows of
Allah and His place (makanih) better than the Jahmiyyah! [..]. All this and its like are
corroborations and proofs for a limit, and whoever does not admit it has committed disbelief in
the Divine Revelation and has denied the verses of Allah!
So it is clear that they believe in a God with limits who has a place - contrary to Imam Abu Ja'far
al-Tahawi and the rest of Ahl al-Sunnah!
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#5 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis say al-Istawa' is Julus - sitting
Says Sh. al-Uthaimeen in Majmu Fatawa (vol. 1, no. 57) quoting Ibn al-Qayyim [provided by
sh. Abul Hasan]:
Quote
‫ عن خارجة بن مصعب في قوله تعالى الرحمن على العرش‬4/1303 ‫وأما تفسيره بالجلوس فقد نقل ابن القيم في الصواعق‬
‫ وقد ورد ذكر الجلوس في حديث أخرجه المام أحمد عن ابن عباس‬.‫هـ‬.‫ ا‬."‫ "وهل يكون الستواء إل الجلوس‬:‫( قوله‬1))‫استوى‬
‫ وال أعلم‬.‫رضي ال عنهما مرفوعًا‬
.
rough translation:
with respect to the sitting, Ibn al-Qayyim has reported in As-Sawaaiq 1303/4 from Kharijah bin
Mus'ab with respect to the saying of Allah the Exalted :The ayah: Ar-Rahmanu Alal Arshi
Istawa, "How can the ascension be anything other than sitting?" and the mention of sitting has
been reported in the Hadeeth from Imam Ahmad from Ibn Abbas, may Allah be pleased with
them both, in a Marfu' fashion. And Allah Knows best
And, to quote sh. Abul Hasan:
Ibn al-Qayyim is talking about a non-existent narration in the Musnad of Ahmad [i.e. he has
fabricated] through Kharija who is actually matruk in hadith anyway!
This also reminded me of the book Kitab al-sunna attributed to Àbd Allah ibn Ahmad ibn
Hanbal (d. 290) by the pseudo-salafis, but whose stand in relation to the Sunna and
anthropomorphism can be judged by the following excerpts:
10 ‫ت أبي يقول سمعت خارجة يقول الجهمية كفار بلغوا نساءهم أنهن طوالق‬ ُ ‫حدثني أحمد بن سعيد أبو جعفر الدارمي قال سمع‬
‫ل َتْذِكَرًة‬
ّ ‫شَقى * ِإ‬
ْ ‫ن ِلَت‬
َ ‫ك اْلُقْرآ‬
َ ‫عَلْي‬
َ ‫ ﴿طه * َما َأنَزْلَنا‬: ‫وأنهن ل يحللن لزواجهن ل تعودوا مرضاهم ول تشهدوا جنائزهم ثم تل‬
‫ وهل يكون الستواء ال بجلوس‬، ﴾‫سَتَوى‬ ْ ‫شا‬
ِ ‫عَلى اْلَعْر‬
َ ‫ن‬
ُ ‫حَم‬
ْ ‫ت اْلُعَلى * الّر‬
ِ ‫سَماَوا‬
ّ ‫ض َوال‬
َ ‫لْر‬
َ ‫قا‬
َ ‫خَل‬
َ ‫ن‬
ْ ‫ل ّمّم‬
ً ‫شى * َتنِزي‬
َ‫خ‬ْ ‫ّلَمن َي‬.
Quote
"Is istiwa other than by sitting (julus)?"
page 5, Kitab al-sunna (Cairo: al-Matbaà al-Salafiya, 1349/1930).
Quote
"He saw Him on a chair of gold carried by four angels: one in the form of a man, another in the
form of a lion, another in that of a bull, and another in that of an eagle, in a green garden, outside
of which there was a golden dais."
Page 35, Kitab al-sunna (Cairo: al-Matbaà al-Salafiya, 1349/1930).
The contemporary salafi preacher Dr. Aidh al-Qarni also describes Allah as 'sitting' on His
throne as can be seen in a recording of one of his khutbas.
And finally, in his Tafsir named "an-Nahrul-Madd", the Grammarian Abu Hayyan al-'Andalusi
reported about Ibn Taymiyah:
Quote
In his handwriting, a book of Ahmad Ibn Taymiyah, who was contemporary with us, which he
called "Kitab-ul-‘Arsh", I read: Allah sits on al-Kursi and has left a space for the Messenger of
Allah to sit with Him.... (see scan)
As for us:
Ibn Àsakir in Tabyin Kadhib al-Muftari (p. 150-151) as quoted here says:
The Mushabbiha and Hashwiyya said: Descent is the descent of His person (dhat) through
movement (haraka) and displacement (intiqal), and istiwa' is His sitting on the Throne and
indwelling on top of it. Al-Ashàri took the middle road and said: Descent is one of His attributes
and istiwa' is one of His attributes and an action He did pertaining to the Throne, called istiwa'.
Imam al-Bayhaqi in al-Asma wa al-Sifat (as translated by Sh. Gibril):
The Preternal One (al-Qadîm) is thus elevated over His Throne but neither sitting on (qâ'id) nor
standing on (qâ'im) nor in contact with (mumâss), nor separate from (mubâyin) the Throne -
meaning separate in His Es-sence in the sense of physical separation or distance. For "contact"
and its opposite "separation," "standing" and its opposite "sitting," are all the characteristics of
bodies (ajsâm), whereas "Allah is One, Everlasting, neither begetting nor begotten, and there is
none like Him." (112:1-4) Therefore what is allowed for bodies is impermissible for Him.
Anyone notice any similarities with the beliefs expounded by some of the above 'salafis' and the
following:
In the Bible they wrote :

“Revelation 4:2-11
‘(9) And when the living creatures give glory and honour and thanks to Him Who sits on the
throne, to Him Who lives forever and ever, (10) the twenty-four elders will fall down before Him
Who sits on the throne, and will worship Him Who lives forever and ever, and will cast their
crowns before the throne, saying, For Thou hast maintained my just cause; Thou dost sit on the
throne judging righteously.’Psalms 9:4”.
They wrote:
“God reigns over the nations, God sits on His holy throne.” Psalms 47:8
“...I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, lofty and exalted, with the train of His robe filling the
temple.” Isaiah 6:1
Isaiah Chapter 6, it is written :

“1 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up,
and his train filled the temple.
In the book called Revelation 19:1-10 they wrote:

"And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia;
Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:
For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt
the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand. And again
they said, Alleluia. And her smoke rose up for ever and ever.
And the four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the
throne, saying, Amen; Alleluia.”
The Vision of Rabbi Ishmael

Babylonian Talmud Berakhot 7a:
It was taught:
“Said Rabbi Ishmael ben Elisha: Once I entered into the inner sanctum to offer incense.
And I beheld Akatriel Yah LORD of Hosts sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up.”
Allah's Refuge is sought!

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#6 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis say the Vision of Allah is in a direction
Dr. Muhammad Khalil Harras [described here as "a great Salafi Aalim and research scholar"]
writes in his “Sharh Aqidah al-Wasitiyyah,” page 73:
Quote
“The Mutazila deny the vision. This denial is based on refusing to accept Allah in any direction
for it is necessary for a thing being seen to be in the direction of the seer...”
Imam Abu Ja'far al-Tahawi says:
35. The Seeing of Allah by the People of the Garden is true, without their vision being all-
encompassing and without the manner of their vision being known. As the Book of our Lord has
expressed it: "Faces on that Day radiant, looking at their Lord." (al-Qiyama 75:22-3) The
explanation of this is as Allah knows and wills. Everything that has come down to us about this
from the Messenger, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, in authentic traditions, is as he
said and means what he intended. We do not delve into that, trying to interpret it according to our
own opinions or letting our imaginations have free rein.
No one is safe in his religion unless he surrenders himself completely to Allah, the Exalted and
Glorified and to His Messenger, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, and leaves the
knowledge of things that are ambiguous to the one who knows them.
And again:
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#7 Abul Hasan
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Assalamu alaikum
I had said the following a few years back:
---------------------
Mashallah! I have seen all this before and these innovators have yet to reply appropriately. The
strange thing with these Ahlul Hawa is that they claim to agree with Imam al-Tahawi's creedo,
but they blatantly go against it with their distortive explanations using such Mubtadi'in like: Ibn
Abi'l Izz (declared a Mubtadi by Mulla Ali al-Qari), Bin Baz, Salih al Fawzan and the latest
Sharh on Tahawiyya by the distorting enemy of al-Asha'ira: Safar al-Hawali - who was exposed
even by his own pseudo-Salafi brethren. This al-Hawali went as far as attacking al-Albani on the
issue of Irja, as did the latest Mubtadi: Falih al Harbi! This is their latest trend: Refuting and
exposing each other! May Allah guide them and keep us away from their Fitna. Amin.
The father of the idea's spread by the Ahlul Bid'a wal Dalala today was no doubt ibn Taymiyya
and his pupil Ibn al Qayyim al Jawziyya, in the name of the Salaf.
Here is a recent list of works on the Taymiyyan way as mentioned by DR GF Haddad:
1. Fataawaa Ibn Taymiyya fil-Meezaan [Ibn Taymiyya's Fatwas under Investigation]. By

the Mauritanian Shaykh al-Sayyid Muhammad Ahmad Miskah ibn al-Àteeq al-Ya`qubi,
Allah reward him. 500 p. (Damascus 2000.)
2. Al-Kaashif al-Sagheer àn Àqaa'id Ibn Taymiyya [Minor Exposure of the Beliefs of
Ibn Taymiyya]. By Saìd Àbd al-Latif Fawdah. 500 p. (Amman 2000).
3. Risaala fil-Radd àla Ibn Taymiyya fi Mas'alati Hawaaditha laa Awwala Laha [Epistle
in Refutation of Ibn Taymiyya in the Question of 'Created Matters without Beginning'].
By al-Imam Baha' al-Din al-Ikhmeemi al-Misri (700-764). Ed. Saìd Àbd al-Latif
Fawdah. 128 p. (Amman 1998) This was written in refutation of Ibn Taymiyya's belief
that the world is of a pre-eternal nature and exists with Allah since pre-eternity as an
"ever-abiding created object" (makhluqan da'iman!), thus making it necessarily existent
in His Essence (mujaban bi al-dhat) and [making Him] not acting deliberately (la faìlan
bi al-ikhtyar), elevated is He beyond that! Dr. al-Buti in Kubra al-Yaqeenaat al-Kawniyya
pointed out that this is nothing other than Aristotelian philosophy and, before him, Imam
Abu Ishaq al-Isfarayini said that whoever holds such a doctrine is considered a kafir.
4. Risaala Shareefa feemaa Yataàllaqu bi Kam al-Baaqi min Ùmr al-Dunya [Noble
Epistle Concerning the Remainder of the Life of this World]. by Imam al-Sanàni. Ed. al-
Wasabi al-Mathani. (Sanà', 1992). This is a refutation of the same heresy as in #3.
5. Al-Qawl al-Wajeeh fi Tanzeeh Allah Taàla àn al-Tashbeeh [The Eminent Discourse
Concerning Divine Transcendence beyond All Resemblance to Created Things]. By
Shaykh al-Sayyid Abul-Hasanayn Àbd Allah ibn Àbd al-Rahman al-Makki al-Hashimi
6. Al-Salafiyya al-Muàasira: Munaaqashaat wa Ruduud [Contemporary Salafism:

Discussions and Refutations]. By Shaykh al-Sayyid Abul-Hasanayn al-Makki al-Hashimi
7. Al-Farq al-Àzeem bayn al-Tanzeeh wal-Tajseem wayaleeh al-Muqtataf fi Naqd al-

Tuhaf [THe Tremendous Difference between Transcendence and Anthropomorphism].
By Saìd Àbd al-Latif Fawdah. 72 p. (Amman 2001.) Contains a valuable commentary
on al-Shawkaani's Àqida titled al-Tuhaf fi Madhhahib al-Salaf.
8. Tasheeh al-Mafaaheem al-Àqdiyya fil-Sifaat al-Ilaahiyya [The Redress of Doctrinal

Understandings of the Divine Attributes]. By Shaykh Ìsa ibn Maani` al-Himyari. 300 p.
(Cairo 1998.)
---------------------------------------------
Wassalam
Abul Hasan
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#8 sunnistudent
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salam alaykum
Ibn Taymiyyah's Saying of Hawadith with No Beginning Existing Eternally with Allah
This issue is one of the ugliest issues in belief by which Ibn Taymiyyah dissented from the sound
mind and the explicit tradition and Ijma’ of the Muslims. He mentioned this belief in five of his
books: "Minhaj-us-Sunnat-in-Nabawiyyah", "Muwafaqatu Sarih-il-Ma’qul li Sahih-il-Manqul",
"Sharh Hadith-in-Nuzul", "Sharh Hadith ‘Imran Ibn Husayn", and "Naqdu Maratib-il-’Ijma’".
Ibn Taymiyyah's statement in "Minhaj-us-Sunnat-in-Nabawiyyah", Volume I, page 24 is: If you

say to us: You said of the occurrence of the hawadith in Allah, we say to you: Yes, and this
saying of ours is what the Shar’ and mind showed.
He replied to Ibn Hazm for reporting the Ijma’ that Allah existed eternally and no thing existed
with Him, and that the disagreer with this is a kafir. After these words, Ibn Taymiyyah said:
What is stranger than that is his (Ibn Hazm's) reporting the Ijma’ upon the kufr of whoever
contended with the belief that Allah existed eternally by Himself and no thing existed with Him.
Ibn Taymiyyah's statement in "Sharh Hadith ‘Imran Ibn Husayn", page 193,: If the kind of the
creations is assumed to be eternal with Allah, this companionship is not negated by the Shar’ or
the mind, but it is of His perfection. Allah, ta’ala, said that the One Who creates is not equal to
whoever does not create. Then Ibn Taymiyyah said: The creation existed eternally with Him.
Then he said: but many people confuse the self with the kind.
His statement in "Muwafaqatu Sarih-il-Ma’qul li Sahih-il-Manqul", page 291 is: We said: we do

not accept. However, the daily hadith is preceded by hawadith without a beginning.
In the manuscript of "Tashnif-ul-Masami’", page 342, Muhaddith, Usuli Badr-ud-Din az-

Zarkashi reported the agreement of the Muslims upon the kufr of whoever says that the kind of
the world is eternal. After mentioning that the philosophers said the world is eternal by matter
and shape, and that some said it is eternal by matter but its shape is muhdath (has a beginning),
he said: and the Muslims charged them (the philosophers) with deviation and kufr. Before that
Hafiz Ibn Daqiq al-’Id, Qadi ‘Iyad, and Hafiz Ibn Hajar said the like in "Sharh al-Bukhari". Hafiz
as-Subki confirmed this belief about Ibn Taymiyyah in his treatise "ad-Durrat-ul-Mudiyyah" and
as said previously, Abu Sa’id al-’Ala'i did too. This belief was reported also by al-Jalal-ud-
Dawwani in "Sharh-ul-’Adudiyyah". He said: I saw in a writing of Abul-’Abbas Ibn Taymiyyah
the saying that the kind of al-’Arsh is eternal.
The Hanafi ‘Allamah al-Bayyadi mentioned in his book "Isharat-ul-Maram", page 197, after
mentioning the proofs about the beginning of the world: Hence, what Ibn Taymiyyah thought of
al-’Arsh being eternal, as reported in "Sharh-ul-’Adudiyyah", is invalidated.
In his poem, which is famous even among the defenders of Ibn Taymiyyah, and which contained
refuting al-Hilli then Ibn Taymiyyah, among of what as-Subki said: Ibn Taymiyyah has a
refutation to what one of the rawafid (some deviant groups) said that was complete. However, he
mixed the truth with the hashw [The hashw is done by a group called al-Hashwiyyah. It is a vile
group with ignorant members attributing themselves to Imam Ahmad Ibn Hanbal, who is clear of
them. They reported words about him which they misunderstood. Then, they continued with their
bad belief claiming to cling to the Hadith. The best of the muhaddithun (pl. of muhaddith) in his
time, Ibn ‘Asakir used to refrain from teaching them the Hadith and prevent them from attending
his circle in Damascus. This group did not have a head or someone to carry its invalid belief,
except some scattered efforts which were foiled by the Muslims. Then, around the end of the
700th Hijriyyah year, Ibn Taymiyyah advocated the invalid beliefs and ideas of this group.]
whenever he could. He says that there are hawadith with no beginning that occur in Allah. Praise
to Allah; He is clear of what he (Ibn Taymiyyah) thinks about Him.
Ibn Taimiyah is characteristically audacious in rejecting hadith which do not conform with his
purpose at hand even if those hadith are rigorously authentic (sahih) .
A good example of that is the following case: Al-Bukhari reported in his sahih:
“Allah existed and there was nothing other than Him.”
This hadith is in agreement with the [clear-cut] evidence of the Quràn, the sunnah, reason, and
certain consensus (al-ijmà‘ al-mutayaqqan). However, since it conflicts with his belief in the
eternity of the world,45 he turned to another version of this hadith which al-Bukhàri also
reported: “Allah existed and their was nothing before Him.” And he rejected the first version in
favor of the second on the grounds that the second conforms with another hadith: “You are the
first; there is nothing before You.” [He held that the implication was that created things always
existed along with Allah] .
Hafiz Ibn Hajr remarked concerning the correct manner of reconciling the apparent contradiction
in the above-mentioned hadiths:
“In fact the way to reconcile the two versions of the hadith is to understand the second in light of
the first, and not the other way around. Moreover, there is consensus on the principle that
reconciliation of two apparently contradictory versions of a text (nass) takes precedence over
endorsing one version at the expense of revoking the other. ”
Actually, Ibn Taimáyah’s prejudice blinded him from understanding the two versions of the
hadith which, in fact, are not mutually contradictory. That is because the version “Allah existed
and there was nothing before Him.” has the meaning which is contained in His name the First;
whereas, the version “Allah existed and there was nothing other than Him.” has the meaning
contained in His name the One. The proof of this is still another version of the hadith with the
wording “Allah existed before everything. ”
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#9 faqir
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Bismillah.
Salafis say Allah has 'Two Real Eyes'

Sh. al-Uthaimeen RH says in
‫عقيدة أهل السنة والجماعة‬

al-Uthaimeen said:
‫ونؤمـن بأن ل تعالى عينين اثنتين حقيقيتين‬
We believe that Allah possesses two real eyes
The author is trying to establish an attribute of TWO REAL eyes for Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala.
Ibn Hazm stated in Al-Fisal fil-Milal (2:166):
"Saying: 'He has two eyes' is null and void and part of the belief of the anthropomorphists...
Allah[subhanahu wa ta'ala] said àyn (literally: 'eye') and a`yunin (literally 'eyes')... so it is not
permissible for anyone to describe Him as possessing 'two eyes' because no text has reached us
to that effect."
Just to elaborate on Ibn Hazm's words:
The Qur'an states àyni (literally: "My Eye") (see 20:39) in the singular and (literally: "Our
Eyes") (see 52:48, 54:14) in the plural but never two eyes in the dual and nothing about 'two real
eyes'.
Quote
{ ‫} فاصبر لحكم ربك فإنك بأعيننا‬
“So wait patiently (O Muhammad) for the Decision of your Lord, for verily, you are under Our
Eyes.” [Soorah at-Toor: 58]
{ ‫ تجري بأعيننا جزاء لمن كان كفر‬. ‫} وحملناه على ذات ألواح ودسر‬
“And We carried him on a (ship) made of planks and nails, Floating under Our Eyes, a reward
for him who had been rejected!” [Al-Qamar: 13-14]
{ ‫} وألقيت عليك محبة مني ولتصنع على عيني‬
“And I endued you with love from Me, in order that you may be brought up under My Eye.”
[TaaHaa: 39]
Some of the narrations from our Nabi salallahu alayhi wa sallam brought by some in their
support for their belief:
"The Antichrist (al-dajjal) is A'war (one-eyed) whereas your Lord is not A'war (one-eyed)"
[Narrated from Ibn Ùmar in al-Bukhari, Muslim, and the Sunan]
Ibn al Jawzi in Akhbar al-Sifat said (point 40):
“In the same category are the following verses: ‘…In order that you might be reared under My
(watchful) eyes.’ And ‘build an ark under Our eyes.’ The expression ‘Under Our eyes’ is taken
by (some) exegetes to mean ‘under our command’ (amr)’, and by others to mean ‘under Our
oversight (mar’an minna).’ Abu Bakr b. al-Anbari pointed out that among the Arabs the plural
(pronoun) is sometimes used even when the referent is singular; hence, one may say: ‘We
travelled to Basra (when one really means ‘I travelled to Basra’).’ This use of the plural derives
from the practice of kings who are in the habit of saying ‘our command’ or ‘our prohibition.’ The
Qadi (Abu Ya’la) maintained that ‘eye’ is an attribute added to the divine essence (za’ida ala dh-
dhat). Already before him Abu Bakr b. Khuzayma said, in connection with the above verses:
‘Our Lord has two eyes by which He sees.” Ibn Hamid said: ‘We must believe that God has two
eyes.’ This view, however, is an innovation for which there is no justification in scripture.
(Champions of this view) attribute two eyes to God only through a kind of inferential reason
(Dalil al-Khitab) based on the Prophet’s (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) statement: ‘He is not one
eyed.’ These words, however, were meant only to deny that imperfection of any sort can be
ascribed to God….”
In points 217-219, ibn al Jawzi said:
In the Sahihs of Bukhari and Muslim there is a tradition from Anas b. Malik in which it is
reported that the Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) said while discussing (the signs of) the
Antichrist (dajjal): “He will have one eye (a’war), but your Lord is not one-eyed.”
The Ulama maintain that the chief aim of this saying is to assert that God cannot be
described in any way that might imply imperfection, for being one-eyed is obviously an
indication of imperfection. The Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) did not mean to
ascribe to God bodily organs, for there is nothing praiseworthy in the attribution of such to
God.
Ibn Àqil said: “The ill informed sometimes assume that since (the Prophet) denied that God is
one eyed He meant to establish by a kind of inferential reason (dalil al-khitab) that God has two
eyes. This is a serious misunderstanding (of the saying), for by denying that God is one-eyed (the
Prophet) merely intended to negate (the possibility of) imperfection in Him….
Coming on to the next narration I have seen some give as "proof", inshaAllah:
As ‘Ataa’ has narrated from Aboo Hurayrah (ra) from the Prophet (sallAllaahu alayhi wa sallam)
said, ‘When the slave stands in Prayer, he stands between the Two Eyes of ar- Rahmaan…’”
(Narrated by Ibn al-Qayyim in As-Sawaa’iq Al-Mursalah (256))
This is probably the weakest of dalils.
First off if we take the hadith literally, would it mean that there is a big gap between Allah’s two
eyes?
More importantly the sanad for that tradition has been declared weak by the scholars that the
salafiyya refer to: Naasir ad-Deen Al-Albaanee said in As-Silsilah Al-Dha’eefah (1024),
“Dha’eef Jiddan”. Also narrated by Al-‘Uqaylee in Al-Dhu’afaa’ (pg. 24), and Al-Bazzaar in his
Musnad (553 – Kashf Al-Astaar). And Ibn al-‘Uthaymeen also declared it Dha’eef in his long
Sharh to Al-‘Aqeedah Al-Waasitiyyah (1/313-314).
Next is the narration of Abu Hurayra that “The Prophet salallahu alayhi wa sallam recited the
verse "Lo! Allāh commands you that you restore deposits to their owners, and, if you judge
between mankind, that you judge justly. Lo! excellent is this which Allāh admonishes you. Lo!
Allāh is ever Hearer, Seer" (4:58) whereupon he sallallahu alayhi wa sallam placed his thumb on
his ear and his index finger on his eye.”
Abu Iyad al-Salafi & Dawud Burbank state in their reference to this very Hadith:
19 Abu Daawood (3/1324) and it is saheeh
Indeed the hadith is narrated by Abu Dawud, and Ibn Hibban (1:498 #265) with a sound chain,
also from his shaykh Ibn Khuzayma in al-Tawhid, al-Hakim (1:24), al-Lalika’i in Sharh I‘tiqad
Ahl al-Sunna (3:410 #788) and al-Bayhaqi in al-Asma’ wal-Sifat.
Yet, where has the Prophet salallahu alayhi wa sallam said that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala has
TWO eyes?
As I said the Hadith is cited by Ibn Hibban.
What follows is his own commentary (see: 1:498 #265):
Ibn Hibban says:
"By placing his fingers on his ear and eye the Prophet [salallahu alayhi wa sallam] wanted to let
people know that Allah Almighty does not hear by means of the ear that has an auditory meatus
and curves, nor does He see with the eye that has eyelids, a pupil, and a white part. Highly
exalted is our Lord above any likeness with His creatures in any way whatsoever! Rather, He
hears and sees without organ (āla) in any way He wishes."
Imam Al-Bayhaqi said of the same hadīth in Al-Asma’ wal-Sifat (Hashidi ed. 1:462-463):
‫‪What is meant by the gesture narrated in this report is the verification that Allāh is described as‬‬
‫‪possessing hearing and sight. He therefore pointed to the two places of hearing and sight in us to‬‬
‫‪affirm that Allah possesses the Attributes of hearing and sight.‬‬
‫?‪We can go on and on quoting scholars but what is the point when there is no decisive evidence‬‬
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‫‪#10‬‬ ‫‪faqir‬‬
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‫‪Posted 11 June 2008 - 09:07 PM‬‬
‫‪Bismillah.‬‬
‫‪Salafis say Allah is Surrounding the World‬‬
‫‪Says Sh. al-Albani:‬‬
‫‪sh. al-Albani said:‬‬

‫‪ :‬قال في تعليقه على صحيح الترغيب والترهيب ) ‪ ( 116 / 1‬من طبعة المكتب السلمي الثانية ‪ 1406‬ه‍ـ ما نصه‬
‫‪ .‬فائدة هامة ‪ :‬اعلم أن قوله في هذا الحديث ‪ :‬فإن ال قبل وجهه‬
‫وفي الحديث الذي قبله فإن ال عز وجل بين أيديكم في صلتكم ل ينافي كونه تعالى على عرشه ‪ ،‬فوق مخلوقاته كلها كما تواترت فيه‬
‫نصوص الكتاب والسنة ‪ ،‬وآثار الصحابة والسلف الصالح رضي ال عنهم ‪ ،‬ورزقنا القتداء بهم ‪ ،‬فإنه تعالى مع ذلك واسع محيط‬
‫بالعالم وقد أخبر أنه حيثما توجه العبد فإنه مستقبل وجه ال عزوجل ‪ ،‬بل هذا شأن مخلوقه المحيط بما دونه ‪ ،‬فإن كل خط يخرج من‬
‫‪ .‬المركز إلى المحيط ‪ ،‬فإنه يستقبل وجه المحيط ويواجهه‬
‫وإذا كان عالي المخلوقات يستقبل سافلها المحاط بها بوجهه من جميع الجهات والجوانب ‪ ،‬فكيف بشأن من هو بكل شئ محيط ‪ ،‬وهو‬
‫محيط ول يحاط به ؟ وراجع بسط هذا في كتب شيخ السلم ابن تيمية كالحموية والواسطية وشرحها للشيخ = ) * ( زيد بن عبد‬
213 - 203 ‫) العزيز بن فياض ) ص‬
rough translation:
He said in his footnotes on Sahih at-Targhib wat-tarhib, from the 1406 Hijri edition of al-Maktab
al-Islami ath-thani, and I quote,
'Important (point of) benefit: know that his statement in this hadith, 'Allah is in front of his face,'
and in the previous hadith, 'Allah Azza wa jalla is in front of you during your Salat,' does not
negate His being on/above the throne (and) above all of his creations, as the text of the Qur'an
and the Sunnah, and the reports of the Companions and Pious Predecessors report by tawatur
(may Allah be pleased with them and may He grant that we follow them). Despite that, Allah is
expansive and encompasses the world, and has informed us that wherever the slave faces, he is
facing the Face of Allah (azza wa jalla). In fact, this is even the state of that of His creation
which surrounds something other than itself as all lines that come from the center towards what it
is surrounded by face the surrounding object. So if a creation high up faces what it is lower than
and is surrounded by, with its surface, from all directions and sides, then what about the One that
surrounds everything, and He is surrounding and not surrounded?
See the detail of this in books of Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah and like Al-Hamawiyah and al-
Wasitiyah and its sharh by Shaykh Zayd Bin Abdul Aziz Bin Fayyad (p. 203 - 213)
This is something similar to what I noticed from someone called sh. Haitham Hamdan who is an
administrator of the multaqa ahl al-hadeeth forums:
Quote
1) Allah SWT could be either inside the world or outside the world ... It is a matter of agreement
among main stream Muslims that He is outside the world. Being inside the world means that He
SWT mixes with impurities, an aspect of imperfection.
2) The universe is round (sperical).
3) Relative to itself, a sperical shape can only have two directions: a top and a bottom.
4) For a sperical shape, bottom is towards its center, above is away from its center.
5) Allah SWT is certainly away from the center of the world, so He is certainly above it.
and a diagram also posted on the same forum:
Um_Abdullah__s___above__.jpg (27.42K)
Number of downloads: 88
Anyhow, al-Albani is saying that the world is physically surrounded or encompassed by Allah,
implying that the world is physically inside of Him practically likening Him to a pregnant
woman!
For plenty of quotes from the salaf and khalaf denying that Allah is in any direction or place
click on this link. Here I will just add one for now:
Imam al-Hafidh al-Bayhaqi said in his book, Al-Asma' was-Sifat, on page 400 [Kawthari
edition]:
،‫ وأن العبد أينما كان فهو في القرب والبعد من ال تعالى سواء‬،‫والذي روي في ّاخر هذا الحديث إشارة إلى نفي المكان عن ال تعالى‬
‫ واستدل بعض أصحابنا في نفي المكان عنه بقول النبي‬.‫ الباطن فل يصح إدراكه بالكون في مكان‬،‫وأنه الظاهر فيصح إدراكه بالدلة‬
‫ وإذا لم يكن فوقه شىء ول دونه شىء لم يكن في‬،‫ وأنت الباطن فليس دونك شىء‬،‫صّلى ال عليه و سّلم أنت الظاهر فليس فوقك شىء‬
‫مكان‬
".... What was mentioned towards the end of the hadith is an indication of denying Allah has a
place and denying the slave is alike to Allah, wherever he was, in proximity or remoteness.
Allah, the Exalted, is adh-Dhahir--hence, it is valid to know about Him by proofs. Allah is al-
Batin--hence, it is invalid that He would be in a place."
He also said:
"Some of our companions used as a proof to refute the place to Allah the saying of the Prophet,
sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam : 'You are adh-Dhahir and there is nothing above You, and You are
al-Batin and there is nothing underneath You.' Therefore, if there is nothing above Him and
nothing underneath Him, He is not in a place."
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#11 IrfanibnIsmail
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Posted 18 September 2008 - 07:48 AM
Salafis say Allah has 'Fingers'
Muhammed Ibn Abdul Wahab an najdi, the founder of wahhabism said:
Quote
The agreement between the Scripture of the Jews and Islam, in that they both confirm that Allah
has Fingers, though they are unlike our fingers and exactly how they are is unknown to us.
(ibn abdul wahab- kitab at tawhid_chapter 64- Translated by Sameh Strauch

Published by International Islamic Publishing House)
Muhiyudeen Shaikh Abd Al Qadir Al Jilani al Hanabali (rahimahullah) in his Kitab sirr al
Asrar wa Mazhar al Anwar said:
" Our Master the Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wassallam) said, ' The hearts of the children of Adam
are between the two fingers of the All-Merciful. He turns them whichever way He wills.'
The two fingers of Allah are His attributes of the irresistible power of punishment and the
loving and delicate beauty of the beneficence. "
(chapter 14, interpreted/translated by Shaykh Tosun Bayrak al-Jerrahi al-Halveti)

(get the book from here: http://www.al-baz.co...ks_page4.shtml)
This post has been edited by faqir: 25 May 2009 - 12:15 PM
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#12 faqir
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Posted 03 January 2009 - 01:23 PM
Bismillah..
Salafis say Allah has a Shadow
Says Sh. Ibn Baz [may Allah have mercy on him]:
Quote
http://www.binbaz.org.sa/mat/4234
‫مسألة في الصفات‬
‫ل؟‬
ً ‫ فهل يوصف ال تعالى بأن له ظ‬،‫في حديث السبعة الذين يظلهم ال في ظله يوم ل ظل إل ظله‬
‫ فهو له ظل يليق به سبحانه ل‬،((‫[ لكن الصحيحين ))في ظله‬1]((‫ ))في ظل عرشه‬:‫ وفي بعض الروايات‬،‫نعم كما جاء في الحديث‬
‫ وال ولي التوفيق‬.‫ الباب واحد عند أهل السنة والجماعة‬،‫نعلم كيفيته مثل سائر الصفات‬.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[1] ‫ باب فضل‬،‫ ومسلم في كتاب الزكاة‬،660 ‫ برقم‬،‫ باب من جلس في المسجد ينتظر الصلة‬،‫أخرجه البخاري في كتاب الذان‬
1031 ‫ برقم‬،‫إخفاء الصدقة‬.
‫مجموع فتاوى ومقالت متنوعة المجلد الثامن والعشرون‬
Rough Translation:
Issue relating to the Attributes [of Allah]:
In the hadith of the seven of those who will be shaded by Allah in His shadow on the day that there is
no shadow save His shadow, is this attributing Allah the Exalted with a shadow?
Answer:
Yes, as is reported in the Hadith and in some transmissions : "in the shadow of His throne". But, in
the Sahihayn it is : "in His shadow" for He has a shadow that is befitting to Him, the Glorious,
and we do not know its modality (Kayf) just like the rest of His attributes...
Shaykh Gibril commented:
Even in the compilations usually adduced by the anthropomorphists - let alone the commentaries
of the impeccable Ahl al-Sunna - the hadiths mentioning the words "in His shade" (al-Bukhari,
Muslim, Muwatta') are understood in the context of the hadiths mentioning "in the shade of His
Throne" (al-Tirmidhi, Ahmad and others). No one to my knowledge has claimed such a Divine
attribute as "the shade" even among those who did their best to gather all the attributes from a
literalist perspective such as Ibn Khuzayma, al-Harawi al-Ansari, and Abu Ya`la.
Thus Ibn Mandah in al-Tawhid has a chapter entitled "Another exposition showing that the
shade of the Throne is used to shade whomever Allah wishes among His servants" which he
begins by mentioning the hadith "in the shade of His Throne" then he follows it up with the
hadith "in His shade."
Similarly Ibn Hibban in his Sahih has a section-title mentioning "the shade of His Throne" but
the only hadith in that section has the wording "His shade."
Similarly, Qadi Ìyad in Sharh Sahih Muslim explains "His shade" as a possessive adjective of
possession (milk) and that what is meant here is the shade of the Throne, to which Ibn Hajar in
Fath al-Bari adds: "and honor (tashrif)," adding that he considers its explanation as "the shade of
His Throne" preponderant in light of the narration mentioning it explicitly.
Ibn Rajab in his own Fath al-Bari also said "What is meant by 'His shade' is the shade of His
Throne" in light of the hadiths mentioning the latter explicitly.
It is true, as Ibn Baz said, that the hadiths mentioning "His shade" are in the two Sahihs, contrary
to the hadiths mentioning "the shade of His Throne." What he missed, however, is that the latter
as a whole are even more authentic since, as al-Dhahabi said in al-Ùluw, they are mass-
transmitted.
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#13 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
• Posts: 2,488
Posted 15 February 2009 - 11:34 PM
Salafis say Allah performs Jogging / Trotting
An interesting quote I saw on-line - it would be useful if someone who has the book could
confirm it:
In Fatawa al-Aqida by Muhammad b. Salih b. Uthaimin, page 112, he says:

Quote
‫وأي مانع يمنع من أن نؤمن بأن ال تعالى يأتي هرولة‬
"What could forbid us from believing that Allah performs jogging/trotting [harwala]?" [!!!]
Compare that to what is quoted from al-Khattabi:
Allah Almighty is not described by movement, since movement and stillness follow one after the
other in the same entity: it is specifically possible to attribute movement to whatever can be
attributed stillness, and both of them are among the accidents of originated matter (min a`rad al-
hadath) and the attributes of creatures. Whereas Allah is exalted high above them, {There is
nothing whatsoever like unto Him.} (42:11)
Shaykh Gibril also said regarding the hadith: "If My servant comes near Me one hand-span I
come near him one cubit. If he comes near Me one cubit I come near him an arm's length. If he
comes to Me walking, I come to him running." In al-Bukhari, Muslim and others.
Imam al-Tirmidhi said in his Sunan: "It is narrated from al-A`mash regarding the explanation
of this hadith, 'Whosoever comes near Me one cubit I come near him an arm's length,' that it
means with forgiveness and mercy. Thus did some of the people of learning explain it. They
said: Its meaning is only that He says, 'If the servant draws near Me by obeying Me and doing
what I commanded, I am very swift to draw near him with My forgiveness and My mercy.'"
‫ب ِمّني‬ َ ‫ن َتَقّر‬ْ ‫ث َم‬ِ ‫حِدي‬ َ ‫سيِر َهَذا اْل‬

ِ ‫ش ِفي َتْف‬
ِ ‫عَم‬ ْ‫ل‬ َْ ‫ن ا‬ْ‫ع‬
َ ‫َوُيْرَوى‬
‫عا‬ً ‫ت ِمْنُه ِذَرا‬ُ ‫شْبًرا َتقَّرْب‬ِ
‫ل اْلِعْلِم‬ِ ‫ض َأْه‬
ُ ‫سَر َبْع‬ ّ ‫حَمِة َوَهَكَذا َف‬
ْ ‫َيْعِني ِباْلَمْغِفَرِة َوالّر‬
‫ث َقاُلوا ِإّنَما‬َ ‫حِدي‬َ ‫َهَذا اْل‬
ُ ‫عِتي َوَما َأَمْر‬
‫ت‬ َ ‫طا‬َ ‫ي اْلَعْبُد ِب‬ّ ‫ب ِإَل‬
َ ‫ل ِإَذا َتَقّر‬
ُ ‫َمْعَناُه َيُقو‬
‫حَمِتي‬
ْ ‫ع ِإَلْيِه ِبَمغِْفَرِتي َوَر‬
ُ ‫سِر‬ْ ‫ُأ‬
"Qatada said: 'Allah is fastest in forgiving.... What is meant is to express the swiftness of the
response and forgiveness of Allah, as we narrated from Qatada." Al-Bayhaqi, al-Asma' wal-Sifat
(Kawthari ed. p. 285-286; Hashidi ed. 2:51-54).
"He did not mean by this hadith a coming-near in terms of distance, for such is impossible and
inexistent. All he meant was the servant's coming-near in terms of good works, and the coming-
near of Allah in terms of answer and acceptance." Al-Baji, al-Muntaqa (1:357)
"The meaning of His coming closer to us by descending to the nearest heaven, or by His
drawing-near a cubit and an arm's length, is that He treats us with munificence (ikram) in the
manner of the liege-lord that walks towards his servants and condescends to them, turning to
them with full attention (muqbilan àlayhim) and examining their needs one by one." Ibn Àbd
al-Salam, al-Ishara ila al-Ijaz (p. 106).
"This hadith is among the narrations of the Divine Attributes and it is impossible take it in its
outward meaning. We already spoke many times about the hadiths on the Divine Attributes. Its
meaning is, 'Whoever comes near Me with obedience to Me, I come near him with My mercy
and success, and help, and if he does more, I do more. If he comes walking and hastens to obey
Me, I come running, that is, I pour mercy over him and overtake him so that I do not make him
need to walk much in order to attain his goal.' The message is that his reward is many times over
proportional to his coming near." Al-Nawawi, Sharh Sahih Muslim (17:3-4).
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#14 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
• Posts: 2,488
Posted 24 May 2009 - 11:22 PM
Salafis say Allah has a 'Form'
Abd Allah al-Hashidi the "Salafi" editor of al-Bayhaqi's al-Asma' wal-Sifat (2:60) openly
attributes form and shape to Allah Most High:
Quote
"As for our Lord, we affirm that He possesses a form (sura)"
and (2:67)
Quote
"As for us we affirm a form (sura) for Allah unlike forms."
Similarly, the Egyptian 'Salafi' scholar Mohammed Khalil Harras......
‫ محمد خليل هّراس‬،‫ المحّقق‬،‫ي‬ّ ‫ السلف‬،‫لمة‬

ّ ‫هو الع‬
‫ أفنى حياته في التعليم والتأليف ونشر السنة وعقيدة أهل السنة‬،‫جة والبيان‬
ّ ‫ي الح‬
ّ ‫ قو‬،‫ق‬
ّ ‫ شديًدا في الح‬،‫كان رحمه ال سلفي المعتقد‬
‫والجماعة‬
....who salafis describe as:
"He was Salafi in creed, stern in establishing the truth, persuasive in establishing his proof, he
spent his life teaching, authoring, and spreading the creed of Ahlus Sunnah wal Jama'a"
says on p. 39 of his commentary on "At-Tawhid" by Ibn Khuzayma:

Quote
‫فالصورة ل تضاف إلى ال كإضافة خلقه إليه لنها وصف قائم به‬
"So 'Image' is not attributed to Allah the way his creation is attributed to Him, because it (His
image), is an attribute which subsists in His essence"
and on pg. 156:

Quote
‫ وقد عاد لنا في صورته التي رأيناه فيها أول مرة فيقول أنا ربكم‬، ‫ثم تبدى ال لنا بصورة غير صورته التي رأيناه فيها أول مرة‬
"Then he appeared to us with an image which is different then what we have previously seen,
and He returned to us in the image we first saw him in and says: 'I am your Lord' "
Meanwhile scholars of Ahl al-Sunna like Ibn Àbd al-Salam in his Mulha state:
"He is not a body endowed with form."
Similarly Ibn al-Jawzi in Daf` Shubahi al-Tashbih (al-Kawthari ed. 1998 repr. p. 35) states:
"Know that it is obligatory upon every Muslim to firmly hold that it is impermissible to attribute
to Allah Most High form (sura), which consists in physiognomy (hay'a) and features (ta'lif)."
Imam al Khattabi said:
What is upon us and all Muslims to believe is that our Lord does not possess a sura (image) or
hay'a (form), for an image implies a modality (kayfiya) and that is negated from both Allah and
His attributes.
‫ هـ( فيما رواه عنه الحافظ البيهقي في ]السماء والصفات[ ما نصه‬388 ‫قال المام أبو سليمان الخطابي )ت‬:
"‫ فإن الصورة تقتضي الكيفية وهي عن ال وعن‬،‫إن الذي يجب علينا وعلى كل مسلم أن يعلمه أن ربنا ليس بذي صورة ول هيئة‬
‫صفاته منفية" اهـ‬
Al-Subkī said: Al-Ash'arī and most of the Scholars of kalām have declared as disbelievers any
innovator whose innovation constitutes or leads to disbelief. For example, if he claims that the
object of his worship possess an image (sūra), or a limit (hadd) and boundary (nihāya), or that it
is permissible to attribute to him movement and stillness. [Cited in al-Kawtharī, Maqālāt (p.
374)]
Click on this link for further information
[translations and quotes courtesy of sidi Hatim and sh. Gibril]

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#15 faqir
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• Group: Marifah
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Posted 25 May 2009 - 10:50 PM
Salafis Say, Allah has ShinS
Muhammad Taqi Al-Din Al-Hilali and Muhammad Muhsin Khan in 'Interpretation of the
Meanings of the Noble Qur’an' - the official Wahhabi translation of the Qur’an in the English
language - say:
Quote
All that has been revealed in Allah’s Book as regards the Qualities of Allah, the Most High, like
His Face, Eyes, Hands, Shins (Legs) , His Coming, His rising over His Throne and others, of all
the Allah’s Messenger qualified Him in the true authentic [sic] Prophet’s [Hadith] as regards His
Qualities like His Descent or His Laughing and others, the religious scholars of the Qur’an and
Sunna believe in these Qualities of Allah and they confirm that these are really His Qualities,
without Ta’wil (interpreting their meanings into different things) or Tashbih (giving resemblance
or similarity to any of the creatures) or Ta`ţil (i.e. completely ignoring or denying them, i.e. there
is no Face, or Eyes, or Hands, or Shins for Allah).
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Islamic theology (Arabic: ‫ عقيدة‬Aqīdah, plural ‫ عقائد‬ʿaqā'id) is a branch of Islamic studies

Marifah Forums: Salafi Creed Vs Sunni

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Salafis On Allah's 'Highness' and Fir'awn :

Sh. Ibn Taymiyya said:

Ibn Taymiyya said:

Qadi Abu Bakr ibn al-Arabi said:

Salafis say al-Istawa' means Istiqrar / Settlement upon the Arsh

Says Sh. Ibn Uthaimeen regarding istawa:

‫‪From al-Hafiz ibn Hajar al Asqalani's Fath al-Bari:‬‬

‫‪Here is a translation of part of what is mentioned above:‬‬

‫"‪The anthropomorphists (al-jismiyya) said: "Its meaning is settledness (al-istiqrar).‬‬

‫‪Here is a short translation [Shaykh GF Haddad]:‬‬

‫‪What Allah Is Not‬‬

‫)‪His Preternity (Beginninglessness‬‬

The footnotes to the above also contain some important quotes:

Footnotes for the above:

‫ن‪ 56‬أخبرنا علي بن محمد بن عبد‬ ‫حي َ‬

‫]‪[arabic quotes courtesy of Sidi Abul Hasan‬‬

Salafis object to declaring Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala transcendent beyond possessing

Sh. Ibn Baz said:

Imam al-Kawthari said about Ibn Taymiyya's similar obfuscation:

Salafis On Allah possessing limits

Says Sh. Ibn Baz on his 'commentary' on al-`Aqida al-Tahawiyya:

Sh. bin Baz said:

see footnote 3: http://www.furqaan.c...muslimcreed.htm

Ibn Taymiyya said:

Abu Sa'id said:

Abu Sa'id said:

Salafis say al-Istawa' is Julus - sitting

And, to quote sh. Abul Hasan:

Imam al-Bayhaqi in al-Asma wa al-Sifat (as translated by Sh. Gibril):

In the Bible they wrote :

Isaiah Chapter 6, it is written :

In the book called Revelation 19:1-10 they wrote:

The Vision of Rabbi Ishmael

Allah's Refuge is sought!

Salafis say the Vision of Allah is in a direction

Imam Abu Ja'far al-Tahawi says:

I had said the following a few years back:

Here is a recent list of works on the Taymiyyan way as mentioned by DR GF Haddad:

1. Fataawaa Ibn Taymiyya fil-Meezaan [Ibn Taymiyya's Fatwas under Investigation]. By

6. Al-Salafiyya al-Mu`aasira: Munaaqashaat wa Ruduud [Contemporary Salafism:

7. Al-Farq al-`Azeem bayn al-Tanzeeh wal-Tajseem wayaleeh al-Muqtataf fi Naqd al-

8. Tasheeh al-Mafaaheem al-`Aqdiyya fil-Sifaat al-Ilaahiyya [The Redress of Doctrinal

Ibn Taymiyyah's statement in "Minhaj-us-Sunnat-in-Nabawiyyah", Volume I, page 24 is: If you

His statement in "Muwafaqatu Sarih-il-Ma’qul li Sahih-il-Manqul", page 291 is: We said: we do

In the manuscript of "Tashnif-ul-Masami’", page 342, Muhaddith, Usuli Badr-ud-Din az-

“Allah existed and there was nothing other than Him.”

Salafis say Allah has 'Two Real Eyes'

Sh. al-Uthaimeen RH says in

‫عقيدة أهل السنة والجماعة‬

We believe that Allah possesses two real eyes

Ibn Hazm stated in Al-Fisal fil-Milal (2:166):

Just to elaborate on Ibn Hazm's words:

{ ‫} وألقيت عليك محبة مني ولتصنع على عيني‬

[Narrated from Ibn `Umar in al-Bukhari, Muslim, and the Sunan]

Ibn al Jawzi in Akhbar al-Sifat said (point 40):

In points 217-219, ibn al Jawzi said:

(Narrated by Ibn al-Qayyim in As-Sawaa’iq Al-Mursalah (256))

This is probably the weakest of dalils.

19 Abu Daawood (3/1324) and it is saheeh