Senate Hearing, 107TH Congress - Nomination Hearing: Joseph Jwu-Shan Jen and James R. Moseley

S. HRG.
107436
NOMINATION HEARING FOR JOSEPH JWU-SHAN

JEN AND JAMES R. MOSELEY
HEARING
BEFORE THE
COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE,
NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED SEVENTH CONGRESS

FIRST SESSION
JULY 12, 2001
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Committee on Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry
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COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY
TOM HARKIN, Iowa, Chairman
PATRICK J. LEAHY, Vermont RICHARD G. LUGAR, Indiana
KENT CONRAD, North Dakota JESSE HELMS, North Carolina
THOMAS A. DASCHLE, South Dakota THAD COCHRAN, Mississippi
MAX BAUCUS, Montana MITCH MCCONNELL, Kentucky
BLANCHE L. LINCOLN, Arkansas PAT ROBERTS, Kansas
ZELL MILLER, Georgia PETER G. FITZGERALD, Illinois
DEBBIE A. STABENOW, Michigan CRAIG THOMAS, Wyoming
BEN NELSON, Nebraska WAYNE ALLARD, Colorado
MARK DAYTON, Minnesota TIM HUTCHINSON, Arkansas
PAUL DAVID WELLSTONE, Minnesota MICHEAL D. CRAPO, Idaho
MARK HALVERSON, Staff Director

ROBERT E. STURM, Chief Clerk
DAVID L. JOHNSON, Chief Counsel
KEITH LUSE,Staff Director for the Minority
(II)
CONTENTS
Page
HEARING(S):
Nomination for James R. Moseley to be Deputy Secretary, U.S. Department
of Agriculture and Joseph Jwu-shan Jen to be Undersecretary of
Agriculture for Research, Education, and Economics ....................................... 01
Thursday, July 12, 2001
STATEMENTS PRESENTED BY SENATORS

Harkin, Hon. Tom, a U.S. Senator from Iowa, Chairman, Committee on
Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry .................................................................. 01
Lugar, Hon. Richard G., a U.S. Senator from Indiana, Ranking Member,
Committee on Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry ......................................... 05
Buyer, Hon. Steve, a Representative in Congress from Indiana ......................... 06
Kerns, Hon. Brian, a Representative in Congress from Indiana ......................... 06
WITNESSES
Jen, Joseph Jwu-shan, of California, to be Undersecretary of Agriculture
for Research, Education and Economics ............................................................. 02
Moseley, James R., of Indiana, to be Deputy Secretary, U.S. Department
of Agricultur ......................................................................................................... 08
APPENDIX
PREPARED STATEMENTS:
Jen, Joseph Jwu-shan ...................................................................................... 22
Moseley, James R. ............................................................................................ 24
DOCUMENT(S) SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD:
Allard, Hon. Wayne .......................................................................................... 28
Jen, Joseph Jwu-shan, Biography ................................................................... 30
Moseley, James R., Biography ......................................................................... 57
Questions and Answers:
Conrad, Hon. Kent ........................................................................................... 79
(III)
NOMINATION HEARING: JOSEPH JWU-SHAN
JEN AND JAMES R. MOSELEY
THURSDAY, JULY 12, 2001
U.S. SENATE,
COMMITTEE AGRICULTURE, NUTRITION AND FORESTRY,
ON
Washington, DC.
The committee met, pursuant to notice, at 8:37 a.m., in room SR
328-A, Russell Senate Office Building, Hon. Thomas Harkin,
[Chairman of the Committee], presiding.
Present or submitting a statement: Senators Harkin, Dayton,
Lugar, Roberts, Allard and Crapo.
STATEMENT OF HON. THOMAS HARKIN, A U.S. SENATOR FROM

IOWA, CHAIRMAN, COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, NUTRI-
TION, AND FORESTRY
The CHAIRMAN. The Senate Agriculture, Nutrition and Forestry
Committee will come to order.
Today, we are continuing our series of hearings on the next Farm
bill. Before we do that however, we are going to turn to two nomi-
nations: the nomination of Dr. Joseph J. Jen to be USDAs Under-
secretary for Research, Education and Economics and the nomina-
tion of Mr. James Moseley to be Deputy Secretary at the Depart-
ment of Agriculture. I would ask both nominees to stand and raise
your right hand and be sworn in.
Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to pro-
vide is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so
help you God?
Mr. JEN. Yes.
Mr. MOSELEY. Yes.
The CHAIRMAN. Please be seated, and I would ask both of you,
do you agree that you will appear before any duly constituted com-
mittee of Congress if asked to appear?
Mr. JEN. Yes, sir.
Mr. MOSELEY. Yes.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.
Today, at first, we will be considering the nomination of Dr. Jo-
seph J. Jen to be USDAs Undersecretary for Research, Education
and Economics. Dr. Jen is currently dean of the College of Agri-
culture at California Polytechnic State University and has a long
and distinguished career in agricultural research, both in the pri-
vate and the public sector. He has published more than 60 sci-
entific articles and published two books. These research achieve-
ments led Dr. Jen to be elected a fellow of the Institute of Food
(1)
2
Technologists in 1992. This is a very high honor, as there are only

about 100 such fellows worldwide.
Clearly, there are many exciting and promising developments
and possibilities in agricultural research. I look forward to working
with you, Dr. Jen, in the important position for which you are nom-
inated. Dr. Jen, I would also like to recognize your wife, Salina
Jen, and your brother, James Jen, whom I understand are here in
the audience someplace behind you there, and we welcome you to
the committee. Thank you very much both for being here.
Before I turn to you, Dr. Jen, for your statement, I would first
like to recognize on my left, the Senator from Kansas, Senator Rob-
erts, if he has any opening statement or
Senator ROBERTS. No, sir, I think we ought to expedite the proc-
ess. Thank you. We have two excellent nominees.
The CHAIRMAN. Yes, we do. We have two excellent nominees.
Senator Dayton.
Senator DAYTON. I second the sentiments.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.
Well, Dr. Jen, welcome to the committee. Congratulations on
your selection, and the floor is yours. Please proceed as you so de-
sire.
STATEMENT OF JOSEPH JWU-SHAN JEN, OF CALIFORNIA, TO
BE UNDERSECRETARY OF AGRICULTURE FOR RESEARCH,
EDUCATION AND ECONOMICS.
Mr. JEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Could I also please ask the
record to show that my sister, Jennice Sih is also here?
The CHAIRMAN. Well, I am sorry, I missed her.
Mr. JEN. She is here from Pennsylvania.
The CHAIRMAN. Well, we welcome you. Thank you very much for
being here. Thank you.
Mr. JEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and distinguished members
of the committee. I am honored to appear before you this morning.
I am grateful to President Bush and Secretary Ann Veneman for
nominating me for the Undersecretary of Agriculture position. I
was born in mainland China and grew up in Taiwan. I came to this
country as a graduate student. When my wife, Salina, and I were
married, we had a total of $48 to start our family.
Only in the United States can someone like me be given the
chance to serve this country in this capacity. If you choose to con-
firm me, I pledge to you that I will do my very best to serve this
country. My professional career involved serving at three land
grant institutions: Clemson, Michigan State and the University of
Georgia; one private enterprise, the Campbell Soup Company; and
then, the largest non-land grant agriculture program at Cal Poly.
My areas of research expertise are in the post-harvest handling
of fresh fruits and vegetables, food texture and biotechnology. I am
active in the scientific professional society and have served on the
California State Board of Food and Agriculture since 1997.
If confirmed, my biggest challenge of the office is the diverse re-
sponsibilities of the REE mission areas and the balance among the
three elements carried in its name. I feel that I know the three ele-
ments of research, education and economics well, and my 20 years
of experience in administration have prepared me to carry out the
3
management of REE. My philosophy has always been to focus on

selective strategic issues and to do a test very well or not do it at
all.
Agricultural research and education are key to building a knowl-
edge reservoir and transfer of applied technology. Economic and
statistical analysis provide the data base and background informa-
tion essential for key policy decisions. With the growing global com-
petition in agriculture and consumer demand for instant knowl-
edge, the REE mission area is faced with critical choices in per-
forming many important tasks with a limited budget. If confirmed,
I look forward to working with members of this committee on
prioritizing the many tasks and challenges facing REE.
Thank you again for this opportunity to consider me for this
highly honored position.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Jen can be found in the appendix
on page 22.]
The CHAIRMAN. Dr. Jen, thank you very much for all that you
have done in agriculture. As a first-generation American myself, I
am glad you are here, and I am glad you are coming into this posi-
tion. We need your expertise and your background vitally, at this
important point where we are especially as it relates to plant and
animal genomics. USDA participates in various efforts, but in my
own personal view, it has yet to provide any true leadership for the
plant, animal and microbial communities by investing in genomics
research at a level that reflects the true value of agriculturally im-
portant organisms from economic, scientific and biomedical stand-
points.
USDAs support for plant genomics is a pittance compared to the
National Science Foundation, and funding is virtually nonexistent
for genomics research in animals, plant pathogens and animal
pathogens. I believe it is time for the USDA to step up to the plate
and ensure that agriculture participates fully in the genomics revo-
lution by providing significant funding for genomics research at the
ARS and at the cooperative state research, education and extension
services.
If I might ask as a general question what steps you might envi-
sion taking to elevate USDAs role and commitment in plant, ani-
mal and microbial genomics.
Mr. JEN. Well, Chairman, you touched an area I did have a little
bit of expertise in myself.
The CHAIRMAN. That is why I asked it.
[Laughter.]
Mr. JEN. In that I have felt for many years that the research in
USDA in this area has not been emphasized and actually opened
the door for some of the private companies to forge ahead on some
of the research in this. In fact, I think, like the roundup soybean:
if it was discovered by the scientists from Iowa State University,
I think it would have a lot more credibility than its being discov-
ered now by Monsanto Company. I think it is an example that
sometimes, we need to put funding in the long-term research, be-
cause 10 or 20 years ago, biotechnology research was not empha-
sized, and there was not the good planning of probably looking into
the future.
4
I think what I would like to do is that hopefully, with my experi-

ence, we can do a little bit of catch-up in the next few years.
The CHAIRMAN. Well, I sure hope so. I serve on another commit-
tee that has been involved in the Human Genome Project at NIH
beginning back in 1992. We have made great progress there, but
there is a whole new realm of knowledge to be gained from plant
genomics and animal genomics which we just have not really
pushed ahead on. I hope that we can now get the Department of
Agriculture moving more aggressively in that area, so I welcome
your interest, and I know your background in that area, and that
is why I wanted to ask the question.
One last thing I wanted to ask before I turn to Senator Roberts,
is regarding sustainable agriculture research. Agriculture research,
again, is vital not just in ensuring the continuation of production
but also the quality of life in our rural communities and the health
of our environment. How do you envision your position focusing on
research programs that will both sustain our environment and
rural communities at the same time?
Mr. JEN. Senator, I am at Cal Poly right now. I am the dean of
Cal Poly. We have a branch campus, about 3,000 acres, north of
Santa Cruz near the coast. It is a piece of land that has more en-
dangered species than any other parcel in California. We have stu-
dents there, and we practice a number of the sustainable agri-
culture practices: holistic management of grazing, organic farming,
trying to preserve the wetlands, and we are studying both the pros
and the cons, the advantages and disadvantages of sustainable ag-
riculture.
It is actually my firm belief that production agriculture and envi-
ronment not only can peacefully coexist, but they can actually en-
hance each other if it is practiced right. Actually, it is one of my
dreams that I want to make that branch campus the model of how
sustainable agriculture can be taught and trained.
The CHAIRMAN. I might ask one other question before I turn to
Senator Lugar, who has joined us. What perspective does your
background in food technology provide you regarding food safety,
and is it your intention to make food safety a high priority?
Mr. JEN. Food safety, absolutely, is a very high priority, because
it is the consumers health at risk and my private industry back-
ground does take that into consideration, because I think all of the
reputable food processors in this country actually, want to produce
food with almost zero risk for food safety. The unfortunate thing
is that there is no such thing as zero risk on anything, but it is
very close.
We do have the safest food in the world right now or in human
history even right now, but, we should continue to improve as
much as possible in that area.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Dr. Jen.
The CHAIRMAN. Before we turn to other Senators, we now have
our former distinguished Chairman of this Committee and now our
Ranking Member, my good friend, Senator Dick Lugar, and I will
turn to Senator Lugar for an opening statement and for an intro-
duction. Then, I know the Congressmen also have timetables they
have to meet, and so, after yours, I will turn to the two Congress-
men for their introductions at that time.
5
STATEMENT OF HON. RICHARD LUGAR, A U.S. SENATOR FROM
INDIANA.
Senator LUGAR. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I had an
opportunity to visit with Dr. Jen earlier this week, and just for the
sake of the record, the FBI reports were made known to you and
to me. I examined those carefully for both of the nominees and
found them completely in order. I just wanted to make that com-
ment for the benefit of the record. I appreciate very much your
coming this morning, Dr. Jen. I strongly support your nomination.
Mr. JEN. Thank you, sir.
Senator LUGAR. It is a special privilege to introduce this morning
a fellow Hoosier, Jim Moseley. He has been nominated by the
President to serve as Deputy Secretary of Agriculture. Jim has ex-
tensive experience as an Indiana livestock and grain farmer. His
extensive business skills and leadership abilities have been ac-
knowledged in a variety of ways nationally as well as in the Hoo-
sier State, including the Indiana Master Farmer Award; the Indi-
ana Outstanding Young Farmer designation; and his being named
as National Outstanding Young Farmer of America.
He started his farming career with the help of the Department
of Agriculture, with loans through what was then called the Farm-
ers Home Administration. Jim Moseley is an example of how the
Federal Government can constructively help beginning farmers get
a start in agriculture and, through hard work, achieve success. In
addition to his farm perspective, Jim is a Washington veteran, hav-
ing served as agricultural advisor to the EPA administrator and as
Assistant Secretary of Agriculture for Natural Resources under
former President George Bush.
Due to his previous Washington experience and his Midwestern
agricultural background, he has a keen sense of what areas are
functioning well at the department as well as those areas needing
immediate attention, such as the Office of Civil Rights and the
Food Safety and Inspection Service. Jim is dedicated to an im-
proved departmental operation, providing more efficient service to
its customers and keeping in mind benefits to taxpayers as a
whole.
He is a Purdue University graduate with a bachelor of science
degree in horticulture. He has actively participated in several orga-
nizations, including the Indiana Nature Conservancy; the Out-
standing Farmers of America; and the Farm Foundation. It is a de-
light to have in the committee room today Jims wife Cathy, who
has been an active partner in that farming enterprise. I believe
that Cathy and Kyle, their son, are with us today, and I would ask
that they stand so that they can be recognized, too. We are de-
lighted that you are here.
I thank Mr. Chairman for allowing me to make this introduction
at this point, and it is also a great pleasure to have our colleagues,
Congressman Buyer and Congressman Kerns, here whom I know
will want to commend our nominee.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Senator Lugar, and I will
turn now to the two Congressmen. I do not know who is senior, but
Congressman Buyer was here first.
[Laughter.]
The CHAIRMAN. I will recognize Congressman Buyer.
6
STATEMENT OF HON. STEVE BUYER, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
CONGRESS FROM INDIANA.
Mr. BUYER. I am always interested in the standards that you
hold here on the other side.
[Laughter.]
Mr. BUYER. I will not be redundant, Mr. Chairman, to the com-
ments made by Senator Lugar. I am not here because the nominee
lives in my new Fourth Congressional District of Indiana. I am
here because I stand with my friends. I have known the Moseley
and the Maple families in Indiana, and both Jim and his wife
Cathy come from good families, and they have worked hard to en-
hance the reputations of good names. I think Senator Lugar was
very accurate when he said that these are two individuals who
started out with nothing, just as Dr. Jen in his testimony started
with $48 in his pocket, Jim and his wife did not start with a net
worth; they started with a net debt, like many who start in agri-
culture, and they have been very successful in their hog operations,
their grain and their feed. I would say that they both are rep-
resentative of Hoosier pride, and they have raised seven children,
and so, I believe that he is truly representative of the family farm.
I also would say that he understands what it means to be a good
steward of the land. I would say that he also has an environmental
conscience. He has a conservation awareness. He has personally
felt the toils of hog operations and how difficult that has been over
the years with its gyrations. Is that accurate?
[Laughter.]
Mr. BUYER. Very high peaks and very low valleys. He also under-
stands the challenges that the farmer faces. This is an individual
of whomthis is an individual who has actually lived and operated
on the farm, so he knows what it means to get the dirt under the
fingernails, and he knows how difficult the challenges are that the
family farmer faces today.
When you have the opportunity to have an individual who will
help lead agricultural interests in this country, it is someone who
has been there; who is there right now, and it is someone to whom
the farmer can personally relate. Also, Senator Lugar commented
that he has a past history in his dealings here in Washington.
Well, I think that can be very helpful in his present leadership
post.
You also, Mr. Chairman, in your questions to Dr. Jen, you used
the words sustained ag research, and Mr. Moseley, in his associa-
tions with Purdue University, he understands the importance of
sustained ag research and how that benefits our society. I stand
here with my friend, and I believe he represents the best America
has to offer to help lead our agricultural interests.
I yield back my time.
The CHAIRMAN. Congressman Buyer, thank you very much. That
is a very fine tribute.
The CHAIRMAN. Congressman Brian Kerns, welcome.
STATEMENT OF HON. BRIAN KERNS, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
CONGRESS FROM INDIANA.
Mr. KERNS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member, fellow
Hoosier.
7
I, too, join with the Indiana delegation represented in rec-

ommending Mr. Moseley for his appointment position today. I rep-
resent Mr. Moseley in Congress, and, of course, Tippecanoe County,
Purdue University, all important to me and near and dear to my
heart. My wife is a graduate of Purdue University, and I know Sen-
ator Lugar has actively been involved in helping the university and
agriculture in Indiana and across the nation, and I just thank Mr.
Moseley and his family, because those of us involved in government
know that it does involve your entire family when you take an im-
portant position like this.
I think he will serve the President well. Indiana and Tippecanoe
County are involved with the Farm Progress show this year, so the
Nation will be watching very closely the home area in Tippecanoe
County, and we will be very proud as Hoosiers to have him as a
member of the Presidents team and working with all of you and
all of us on the House side with the committees as we move for-
ward on the many difficult issues facing agriculture today.
My family and I also live on a small farm in Indiana, much
smaller than Mr. Moseleys, but I can tell you I appreciate the sac-
rifice that he and his family have made over the years to build an
operation and to set a standard for the community of excellent
quality products, and, as we work to expand exports across to other
lands and other countries, I think Jim is most qualified and can
bring a real hands-on approach to some of the important issues we
face in the Congress.
I want to thank the committee, the chairman and the ranking
member for allowing me to recommend and support our fellow Hoo-
sier today, and it is a great honor to be with you. Thank you, Mr.
Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. Congressman Kerns, thank you again for your
very fine tribute.
The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Moseley, we welcome you back. Of course,
we are familiar with your previous tenure here in Washington. I
congratulate you for that. You did a great job as an advisor at EPA
and also as the Assistant Secretary for Natural Resources in the
previous administration. I think both of these will serve you well
in your new position as Deputy Secretary.
I might add that by listening to Congressman Buyer, Congress-
man Kerns and Senator Lugar, it sounds like the only tribulation
as a family farmer that you have not gone through is milking cows.
Is that right?
[Laughter.]
The CHAIRMAN. Now, that indicates to me you are a real smart
guy.
[Laughter.]
Mr. MOSELEY. Sir, I do not do dairy.
The CHAIRMAN. I do not do dairy! You are a smart guy!
Well, Mr. Moseley, welcome back. I know the Congressmen have
tough schedules. You may stay if you like, or if your schedules com-
pel you to leave, you may be excused at any point you want. I
would turn now to Mr. Moseley for his statement.
8
STATEMENT OF JAMES R. MOSELEY, OF INDIANA, TO BE
DEPUTY SECRETARY, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE.
Mr. MOSELEY. Thank you, Senator.
Good morning, and thank you, Mr. Chairman, Senator Lugar,
Congressman Buyer and Congressman Kerns. I really appreciate
your kind words and the other members of this committee as well.
It is a pleasure to be here and an honor to appear before this com-
mittee. In awaiting this moment, I have had some time to reflect
on the magnitude of the task before me. Those thoughts and an ex-
planation of the attributes that I will bring to this position if con-
firmed as the Deputy Secretary are contained in my formal state-
ment that, with your permission, sir, I will submit for the record.
The CHAIRMAN. Without objection.
Mr. MOSELEY. Despite an attempt at brevity here, I want to state
clearly how honored I am to have been asked by President Bush
and Secretary Veneman to serve the Department of Agriculture. I
have been fortunate enough to experience a stint at USDA about
11 years ago, and that period when I served as Assistant Secretary
of Agriculture for Natural Resources Environment was a proving
ground for the more complex job of Deputy Secretary.
That position included managing the Forest Service, USDAs
largest agency, and that gave me a tremendous opportunity to
work with some very difficult public policy issues in a significant
way. Just as important is my experience managing my farm, which
is now a large, diversified crop and livestock operation in Indiana.
I grew up on a farm in Indiana and was fortunate enough to start
with Cathy my own farming operation about 31 years ago with
help from Farmers Home Administration. It was necessary to have
that help, because we started with no equity other than our college
educations.
My wife, Cathy is with me today, and I endured the economic
growing pains of turning a modest, 250-acre rented operation into
a small business vital enough to support several employees and
partners plus our seven children.
On the personal side of farming, I know the pleasure of walking
through the hog barn at night, watching the baby pigs lined up
along their moms belly nursing. It is still a special moment, no
matter when you do it. I understand the feeling of accomplishment
that comes from looking out over a field of corn in the early morn-
ing light and seeing it change day-by-day. There is a satisfaction
in that that few other experiences provide.
Unfortunately, though, I also know the difficulties of making
ends meet when production costs rise or commodity prices drop un-
expectedly. We survived the hog crisis three years ago, but I know
too many producers who did not, and I still feel the pain. Still, I
count on the sum total of my experiences to help me connect with
the producers that the Department, by our stated mission, has the
responsibility to represent.
I also know that without the assurances that the Department
provides in important areas of food safety and the environment
that the consumers here and abroad will not have the confidence
to trust what our farmers produce. We must be vigilant in our pur-
suit of credible ways to maintain that trust.
9
We also have the need to accomplish this with dignity and re-
spect for everyone involved. The Department must honor all people
and right any wrong that may have been committed in our past.
I pledge my commitment to this committee and to all the Members
of Congress to do the best job that I have the energy to accomplish.
For me, life is about honor, integrity and commitment. Because I
have more questions than answers right now, all I can do is pledge
to you to continue to live those values. They have served Cathy and
I well, and we would expect them to continue to do so.
To make progress, we must agree on the right course for Amer-
ican agriculture. In that regard, I look forward to working with
each one of you to serve the needs of those who depend upon us
to help them. I thank you, Mr. Chairman, for the opportunity to
appear before you today. It truly is an honor, and I would be happy
to answer your questions.
[The prepared statment of Mr. Moseley can be found in the ap-
pendix on page 24.]
The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Moseley, thank you very much for your elo-
quent statement and for your excellent written statement, which I
read the other evening. I again want to personally thank you for
your willingness to come back to Washington and to serve in what
Abraham Lincoln called the peoples Department, Agriculture, and
I know you will do an outstanding job as our deputy there.
I just have a couple of short questions before I turn to Senator
Lugar. Several of the articles you submitted in your packet which
I read indicate, that you have a very strong interest in conserva-
tion. There is a lot of talk that this new Farm bill coming up is
going to be strongly conservation-oriented. Personally, I hope so.
Senator Smith and I and several others on this side and some on
the other side have introduced a conservation bill which has been
dubbed the Conservation Security Act.
I hope that you would take a look at that, and please give us any
advice, suggestions, observations, you have on what needs to be
done with that bill or any other observations you have on how we
can both enhance farm income and, at the same time, provide help
for farmers who are practicing good conservation methods. My view
has been that in the past, so many farmers have been using their
time, their equipment, sometimes their own money to be good stew-
ards, and they are not getting much reward for it. However, if they
take land out of production for CRP or WRP or something like that,
then, they can get paid for it.
It seems to me that we need to bridge that and get to the point
where we are actually providing help and support for farmers who
are indeed being good stewards of the land, and that is sort of the
basis of that bill.
You do not need to respond. I am just asking to please take a
look at it. I am open for any suggestions or advice that you might
have for us, and if you have any general comments on conservation
itself.
Mr. MOSELEY. Well, Chairman, obviously, conservation has been
something that has been a part of my life since I was a little child,
because I remember going with my grandfather and planting trees
and going fishing with him on the farm pond that he established,
and we have continued that tradition. My background is that we
10
have to have conservation on every piece of agricultural land, work-

ing lands as well as those lands that might be set aside for wildlife
habitat or whatever purpose. I am going to be delighted to spend
some time working with you, because this is something that is very
important to me.
The CHAIRMAN. I appreciate that very much.
Second, it is my understanding you have adopted some innova-
tive technologies to handle the manure from your hog operations.
Again, this has bedeviled a lot of us in many parts of the country
where we have had more and more concentration of livestock oper-
ations, particularly hog breeding operations, and we are having a
problem in terms of addressing the manure issue. I hope that we
can address this in the next Farm bill, and again, since you have
been there and done it, I would appreciate any suggestions and ad-
vice you have on how we can help farmers, who are producing hogs
to be able to handle the manure problem that they have.
It is funny. I am like you. When I was a kid, we never referred
to it as waste. This is a valuable resource that everyone used, and
we used it as fertilizer, and I think we have to get back to that.
We have to think of economical ways of doing that. Any sugges-
tions you have on that, I would appreciate.
Mr. MOSELEY. You are absolutely right, Chairman. It is not a
waste. There was a period of time I think we went through, and
we considered it to be so. That is not the case. It is a valuable re-
source that needs to be used. We have looked at that in our oper-
ation as we have grown over the years, and we have looked at it
as a resource that we could use, and we have tried to develop some
new and innovative technologies to make it easier to handle it and
make sure that we do it in an environmentally responsible and sen-
sitive way.
When those discussions come up, I will share whatever little bit
of expertise I may have been able to accumulate to this point.
The CHAIRMAN. Which is considerable. Thank you very much,
Mr. Moseley.
Mr. MOSELEY. Thank you.
The CHAIRMAN. Senator Lugar.
Senator LUGAR. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I
share the Chairmans enthusiasm for the conservation work that I
am certain will be a part of our committees efforts in the Farm
bill, and I want to recognize again, as he has, your leadership in
this area, your prior service in Washington as well as on the farm
in Indiana.
I would just note for the record that in 1985, 97 cents of every
financial assistance dollar for conservation was put on conservation
on working lands, and only 3 percent went to land retirement in
1985. Now, today, only 15 percent goes to the working land con-
servation part of this and 85 percent to land retirement. I make
that point because clearly, this is going to be an issue before the
committee, and certainly, Senator Harkin and others as they have
tried to address this legislation recognize that.
I want to make a point that also, after our hearing on conserva-
tion early this year, conservation people in Indiana came to me and
revealed that every acre in Indiana is now covered by extensive
maps. For instance, on my farm, they could identify acre-by-acre
11
the soil types. They could even make an estimate in a normal year
with normal rainfall what the yield would be for corn and for soy-
beans. There is an extraordinary amount of information available.
Now, on top of that, then, they also have some suggestions for
what we ought to do to enhance the value of that land and, per-
haps even more importantly, the cleanliness of the water in terms
of the runoff and various other things that will be important in the
stewardship of that land. I simply make this point because I know
that you share an enthusiasm for the EQIP program and for others
that we have adopted, and maybe you have some ideas in the fu-
ture. Do you have any at this point that you want to reveal to us,
or can you give us some landscape of what kind of leadership you
may offer in the conservation area?
Mr. MOSELEY. Well, in light of the need for brevity, I will not go
into a long diatribe as to all of the things. Senator, this is a very
large area of concern, and there are many things that we can do.
It is putting in place the right incentives; making sure that we
have the resources available. Literally, I could sit here for an hour,
which you do not want me to do, and talk about this.
The key thing is that the Department does need to provide lead-
ership. We have some tremendous opportunities. The new GIS
technology that I think that the folks from Indiana were alluding
to is very significant in terms of helping us to give some sense and
idea of where these resources are at and how we can best utilize
them so that we do not end up with rivers and streams that have
contamination.
The whole issue of soil quality is something that I think we will
see emerge in the debate as we move forward here, and if we en-
hance soil quality, we enhance water quality. There is a broad
array of issues that we need to address, and what I would like to
do is pledge to you that I will be a leader within the Department
to try and accomplish those things and be in discussion and debate
with the Members of this Congress, and we will work on it.
Senator LUGAR. Well, I thank you for that response and likewise,
your desire for brevity. I am hopeful that after your confirmation
that swiftly, that leadership that you have mentioned will be forth-
coming; in other words, that you will make recommendations, or
you and the Secretary together or however you want to manage
your testimony or your information, to all of us, because the time-
frame is such in which if you have important ideas, they really
need to be made known
Mr. MOSELEY. Yes.
Senator LUGAR [continuing]. Rapidly, and I think the Chairman
that would share that thought: if we are to begin forming a con-
servation title of the Farm bill, why, the grist for the mill needs
to become swiftly.
I would just ask one question of Dr. Jen, and that is from our
conversation earlier this week, I know of your leadership in the re-
search area your enthusiasm for this, but I would just take the op-
portunity to say this committee has tried to authorize cutting-edge
research, merit-based, anyone in the country could apply, really,
that has extraordinary ideas.
Unhappily, all that we have authorized, $120 million a year for
5 years, for 2 years, the House of Representatives appropriators X-
12
ed out the cutting-edge part of it, and we did not have that benefit.
Now, the third year, to his credit, Secretary Glickman found ways
in which the Department of Agriculture could revive the idea, so
$120 million of extraordinary research projects occurred last year
in the country, and I hope that may occur again.
Likewise, in our biomass quest, and this is so important, because
everyone talks a good game about agriculture and energy, but the
amount of follow-through has been, if not negligible, disappointing.
I am hopeful that your enthusiasm in both of these areas will like-
wise manifest itself in suggestions to us either for legislative enact-
ment or what you and the Secretary can do administratively. We
need to move the ball ahead, because there is fertile ground, I
think, with legislation on the books, but if we need to tweak the
system, this is the time, and your comments and suggestions would
be very helpful in a short period of time.
Do you have any further comment this morning?
Mr. JEN. Senator Lugar, thank you very much. I think like you
said, like you and I discussed briefly, the competitive grant pro-
grams it is one of the forms of funding mechanisms that can prob-
ably bring the best research return with the least amount of invest-
ment. Not only that, it can also have the chance of having more
team kind of approach, that multi-disciplinary type of approach
than a set formula way of doing things and things like that.
That does not mean that, formula funding is not good, because
I think it is absolutely needed for just a base program as well. I
think if any new idea of research and the cutting-edge type of re-
search is launched, I think the competitive grant program should
be the way to go.
Senator LUGAR. Thank you very much.
Mr. JEN. I really thank you for that question.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Lugar.
Senator Dayton.
Senator DAYTON. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Moseley, looking at your reports over the last several years,
your own farming operations are almost a microcosm of American
agriculture in that the extent of your participation totally appro-
priately and probably necessarily in the Government programs
both in terms of dollars as well as the number of programs under-
scores my experience with Minnesota farmers as well, that they are
more and more dependent financially on the Government payments
rather than market prices, and the number of programs they are
participating; it just seems as though to be a successful farmer
these days, you have to be farming to fit into the Government pro-
gram niches rather than into market-based agriculture.
Do you have any thoughts at the macro level on how, especially
with this new Farm bill, we might address that?
Mr. MOSELEY. Well, I certainly have had a lot of experience in
this as you have been able to detect. We have participated in price
support programs for as long as they have been available.
Senator DAYTON. Sure.
Mr. MOSELEY. It became a competitive issue, really. I can recall
back several years ago; in fact, I believe that Senator Lugar, the
last time I was before this committee, questioned me about this.
We literally got to a point in 1986 when, if we were not participat-
13
ing, and we had not participated for a couple of years, and we did
not participate in a program, we literally could not retain our asset
base. We could not retain the land that we had been farming. We
were not competitive. Other people could take the Government pro-
gram support, and they could literally bid more for that resource
than what we could.
It was essential at that point in time. I think what you are point-
ing out here is that there are cycles in agriculture, and there are
those up times that we feel very good, and then, there are those
down times for whatever reason. It may be prices; it may be
drought; it may be a broad national disaster; it may be a very re-
gional, localized. There are those times when farmers need some
help, and I understand that.
Now, for us to bring forward the right policy and figure out when
we need to apply it and how we need to apply it I think is some-
thing that this body, as well as the Department of Agriculture,
needs to be fully engaged in in the debate and the discussion. I do
not have a specific set of recommendations for you today about how
to do that, but I will tell you that with the experience and the
background that I have, I can certainly be fully engaged within the
Department in terms of when a policy recommendation might come
forward I can evaluate: will that work at the farm level? Will that
really help farmers?
Senator DAYTON. Do you consider current market prices for basic
agricultural commodities to be too low? If so, do you have any rec-
ommendations or a sense of a direction that we need to go in to
boost those market prices?
Mr. MOSELEY. The current market price for any farmer is always
too low.
[Laughter.]
Senator DAYTON. Well-said.
Mr. MOSELEY. Now, that is just reality speaking. Very few of us
go to the coffee shop and talk about how wonderful the prices are.
Obviously, we have gone through a very distressed time both in the
crops and the livestock, and we have some major challenges here.
We have trade issues that if we could open up this trade, it would
make a significant difference for the agricultural economy in this
country.
We have issues there that need to be addressed, but in the mean-
time, and there are opportunities for any size of farm to do better,
to move further up the food chain in terms of the value added that
they are putting into their products. We are not going to have all
of our answers come from trade, and we are not going to have all
of those answers addressed immediately, and I think there is a
need for us to continue to work at making sure that there is a safe-
ty net for farmers. What that is right now, I am not going to give
you an idea, because I have questions as well.
I will be happy to work with you, and we will try to figure it out.
Senator DAYTON. Thank you.
Dr. Jen, I would just like to go back for a brief time here to the
Chairmans comment about feed lot operations, because we have a
horrific problem in parts of Minnesota with, now, the scale of live-
stock production and these legumes and the effects they have on
their neighboring farmers and neighboring communities, and I
14
guessand I may not be fully aware of everything going on, but

it seems to me that the USDAs research involvement in this area,
at least the dissemination of that information, has been just minus-
cule relative to the scope of the problem, and do you have any
thoughts going in on how the USDA could both make that research
more applicable to current conditions and also disseminate that in-
formation more effectively?
Mr. JEN. Senator, I could not speak about the dissemination of
the report and things like that, and if you want, if you choose to
confirm me, I can look into it and report back to you on why it was
not being done.
As far as the biomass, that is a research area that is very multi-
disciplinarily oriented. It needs engineers and other people besides
just agricultural scientists to be able to get it done. It is kind of
like we had a little project at Cal Poly where the dairy manures
in the legumes are being covered with engineers help, trying to
harvest the energy and heat the waters for the dairy barn to use,
and that is kind of like the biomass is being turned into an valu-
able thing.
At the same time, it also takes out the odors for the dairy farm-
ers. It is still in the experimental stage, but certainly, these are the
types of research projects, but they cannot be done just by the ani-
mal science people or the dairy science people. We brought in, real-
ly, the engineers, the ag engineers and the mechanical engineers
and other people; the flavor chemists from food science in a team
approach, and I think that latches on a little bit of one of my an-
swers to Senator Lugar: to me, todays research has to be ap-
proached by a team. No longer is a single scientist doing a single
discipline to solve a problem. The problem is multi-faceted and
needs a team approach for that.
Senator DAYTON. Thank you, Dr. Jen.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Dayton.
Senator Roberts.
Senator ROBERTS. Yes, thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I am struck by the caliber of our nominees and the tenor of this
mornings hearing. I think this has been a class act hearing. I
think that any farmer and rancherwell, yes, we do have TV; I
apologizebut I think any farmer or rancher who would read the
testimony here and hear the responses of our two nominees would
feel pretty darn good that we are going to have very capable hands
down at the Department.
Kika de la Garza, who is the chairman emeritus of the some-
times powerful House Ag Committee
[Laughter.]
Senator ROBERTS [continuing]. Used to say in agriculture, there
is a special feeling, a special commitment. You have to feel the
ground; have to feel the earth. We, at that time, on the minority
side used to listen to those speeches quite often, as my colleagues
will testify. He was really making a point, and I think both of the
nominees certainly have that feeling. I am struck by the only in
America stories of both nominees: 48 bucks and then starting out
with the beginning farmer program. I remember in 1980, when I
first ran for Congress, I said the most important question in agri-
15
culture today is where is the next generation of farmers going to

come from? Jim, you are an outstanding example of that, you and
your family.
Now, for both of the nominees, return with me now to the not-
so-thrilling days of the ALAR scare with apples, and you could
apply that to any of the food safety concerns that we have in to-
days world, whether it is E. coli or whether it is hoof and mouth,
or whether it is salmonella or whatever is happening, and I re-
member Dick Ling talking about this, and I remember Ed Mad-
igan, our dear friend and colleague, and his efforts down at the De-
partment with Ann Veneman and yourself, Jim, to put together
some kind of an immediate response team with FDA, EPA and
USDA so that when we have a food safety concernscare is a bet-
ter wordand we have people on television who are saying very
alarmist things, and I understand that, because in terms of food
safety, you have to err on the side of the public and public safety.
It seemed to us that we could have more of a response team
where you used the land grant schools and people like Dr. Jen;
state departments of health and environment and agriculture. I
have been talking to Ann about thatpardon me, Secretary
Venemanabout putting together again a response team to, a, set
the record straight; basically inform the public of what is going on;
and, more importantly, what we are doing about it.
We just had a situation, in Texas and perhaps in Oklahoma, I
hope not, in regards to karnal bunt. We have just had the Star
Link situation. You know about hoof and mouth. I would hope that
we could work on putting together an immediate response team to
calm the public; get the sound science facts out; and demonstrate
to the public about what we are doing. I think it would really help.
Would you like to make a comment on that regard?
Mr. MOSELEY. Senator Roberts, I do remember ALAR. It seems
like controversy precedes me and hopefully does not follow me, but
I had just been appointed at EPA when the ALAR issue broke, and
I know that there was a lot of concern about the issue, but there
was probably more concern in this body and from the agriculture
community out there about the way in which we responded to it.
I think we have learned a little bit. I think we are better today
than we were then. Are we good enough? Probably not.
I hear your admonition. We need to be immediate insofar as we
can be, immediate in our response, because many times, these
issues are emotionalized before we have an opportunity to get out
in front of them, and we will work with EPA and FDA and any
other Federal agency that may need to be brought to the table to
try to accomplish the objective.
I hear your admonition, and it is one that is very real and I know
heartfelt, and I feel the same.
Senator ROBERTS. Dr. Jen, would you like to add anything, sir?
Mr. JEN. Thank you, Senator Roberts.
In my profession ,it is food processing. I attend the Institute of
Food Technologists. That profession is interesting in that they have
science communicators assigned, the university people expertise as-
signed, in every single state that connected to the media. Whenever
there are certain questions related with food processing and the
16
food safety part of it is involved, they gave the media that person
who has expertise to respond in that.
It has worked reasonably well. I think, if we can expand that
into all of the disciplines within agriculture, we might be able to
develop a quick response team. That is another different way of
doing it.
Senator ROBERTS. I think that aspect is very important. I know,
Tom, you are a member of the Council of Agriculture Science and
Technology that is a very important group, and at least 10 years
ago, they were very influential and hope they can be again.
I know my time has expired. I just want to make one other point.
We held a hearing, a bipartisan hearing, several months ago in the
Armed Services Committee, in the Emerging Threats Subcommit-
tee, and we had appropriators there; we had the Intelligence Com-
mittee there; it was a very widespread hearing, and it was in re-
gard to homeland security, and we brought up the issue, and Sec-
retary Veneman testified along with 46 other Federal agencies all
involved in homeland security. The subject was agroterrorism and
the possibility that some state-sponsored outfit or some non-state-
supported group or any group of wackos that wanted to get after
our nations food supply and what the status of that was, and
where was the Department of Agriculture in regards to immediate
response or hopefully to detect and deter and then, in the con-
sequence, management?
I am very concerned that we are not there. The FBI tells us that
this is very, very high risk. The probability used to be low. Now,
that probability is working up.
I just sort of lay that out there. It is something that we do not
talk about much in the USDA, but, I mean, the nations food sup-
ply and the kind of chaos that would occur if, in fact, we have a
major infestation is a very serious thing. I do not ask you to re-
spond. I just wanted to indicate my concern.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Roberts.
Senator Allard.
Senator ALLARD. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much.
I would just emphasize to both nominees that I concur with the
comments made by my colleagues on the committee. I am im-
pressed with your qualifications and the experience that you bring
to the USDA. I wish more people had your qualifications and
experience
Senator ALLARD [continuing]. Who oversee many of the programs
that affect agriculture.
I come from a unique part of the country where you cannot rely
on nature itself to provide a favorable environment for farming. We
have to do things in my part of the country to enhance the soil and
to provide water for farmers. There are agricultural irrigated enter-
prises in the State of Colorado, and anybody who is in agriculture
does some irrigation to one degree or another, or, if they do not,
they have a very limited dry land farm situation.
Part of the ability for them to survive is good science. It needs
to be further developed not only for the production side, but for the
regulators as well. Regulators need to have good science so that
17
when they are making the calls, they are based on good, sound fact
and not something that has been conjured up. I also want to em-
phasize how important I think education is, not only to the farmer,
but to the public. All of this relates to food safety issues.
In Colorado, we also have water issues. Sometimes nitrogen will
build up in the flowing stream. We can bring the water out; for use
in irrigation. If we know how much nitrogen is already in the
water, it may limit the amount of fertilizer that the farmer has to
put in. Then, it may be returned to the stream in better condition
than when it came out.
I hope that in your review of some of the policies in the Depart-
ment of Agriculture that you would be very cognizant of how im-
portant water is in semi-arid climates like the State of Colorado.
At times, we have agencies who feel like they want to take that
from the farmer, and they have an adverse impact on that farmer.
It puts him out of business.
I do not know whether you have given that any thought, but I
hope that you will keep that in mind during your deliberations. Mr.
Moseley, maybe you would like to respond to my education com-
ments and perhaps both of you would like to respond to the good
science aspects I have mentioned.
Mr. MOSELEY. Well, you have given me a long list of things that
I could respond to, but it is obvious that in terms of the irrigation
issues in the West, they are exceedingly important to agriculture.
I have a number of friends of mine in the Western states, Califor-
nia specifically, but they are not in agriculture unless they have ir-
rigation. I understand the difficulty and complexity of that issue.
It is not easy. Water rights are a fundamental part of the West,
and I certainly sense that.
We, in our part of the world, why, we have the problem of getting
rid of water. You shared something with me today that I was not
aware of, and that just goes to show that we can learn something
every day, that you can use the water, take the nitrogen out, put
it back in the stream, and it is better. I was not aware of that.
That is what technology, that is what scientific searching, does for
us. Then, once we are able to accomplish that, we educate people.
You have done that with me today, and that is the kind of activ-
ity that we are about, one of the important activities of the Depart-
ment of Agriculture. I know that is Dr. Jens area, but I am begin-
ning to develop a very good relationship with Dr. Jen, though we
have not known one another very long. It has just come together
very quickly. I have a tremendous amount of confidence that with
he and I both working together, we are going to be able to forward
the need of farmers and consumers in this country with respect to
research and education.
Mr. JEN. Senator, I would like to probably address very briefly
about education of the general public. I think you struck another
chord that I feel very strongly about; that is, I feel that agriculture,
the field in general, including academia and the Federal Govern-
ment and all that, we have done a pretty good job of informing our-
selves, but we have not done as good a job of informing the general
public.
I had an interesting experience when I got to Cal Poly a few
years ago. I was interested, and I said do we have a Department
18
of Ag Communication, and the answer was no. We do have a group

of students who are interested in that, so I put together a program
that combined journalism and agriculture together in ag commu-
nication, in order, in other words, for them to be able to tell not
only the farmer but tell the general public the knowledge.
The sad thing to me, Senator, is that they have an agriculture
communication national committee or national association, and we
send our students that never had a major in ag communication to
compete. There are 15 categories. They come back and tell me that,
Dr. Jen, we are the second-best in the nation.
I feel it is very sad, because the fact is I do not even have a
major. Our students did not even train in it. I just put a quick fix
of get some journalism faculty to teach our agriculture kids how to
read and how to write to the general public, and they are already
the second-best in the nation.
I see a tremendous need of the ag education field and that it is
in my shop in USDA. You can be sure that I will look into it and
see if we can strengthen that part of it.
Senator ALLARD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I see my time is al-
ready expired. It seems like when it is your time, that red light
turns on so quickly.
[Laughter.]
Senator ALLARD. There are many other areas I would like to
cover, but I want to personally thank these nominees for their dedi-
cation to public service and I look forward to working with them.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Allard.
Senator Crapo.
Senator CRAPO. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. In the in-
terests of time, I will not ask any questions, so you can relax. I do
want to associate myself with the comments that Senator Allard
made about the water issue in the West. I represent Idaho, and we
are having a drought there this year, and we have tremendous
competing needs for water. In fact, if you think about it, most of
our civilization lives around water for a lot of reasons. It is the core
of our drinking water for municipal and industrial development. In
the West, we rely on a lot of our systems for flood control. It is
recreation; it is our environment; it is irrigation; it is power produc-
tion. I think there are very few aspects of most of our lives that
are not dramatically impacted by water management, and agri-
culture is central to that, particularly in my state. I do want to
focus on those issues with you in the future.
I would simply conclude my comments by thanking both of you
for being willing to serve. We know what it takes for a person these
days to be willing to step up and say yes when the President asks
for you to come forward and serve or when the Secretary of Agri-
culture asks for you to come forward and serve, and I just want you
to know that we are aware of the tremendous sacrifices that you
have made and are making, and we appreciate men of your caliber
being willing to come forward and help our country in these times.
Mr. JEN. Thank you.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Crapo.
Again, I want to echo the sentiments of my colleagues here in
thanking you both for your dedication and devotion to public serv-
19
ice, and the sacrifices you are making to assume these positions.
This committee will, as soon as we can get a quorum, move expedi-
tiously on these nominations.
If there is nothing more to add, I will excuse the witnesses, and
we will move to the second phase of our hearing this morning on
feed grains and oil seeds. Thank you both very much.
Mr. MOSELEY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. JEN. Thank you.
[Whereupon, at 9:40 a.m., the committee adjourned.]
APPENDIX
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Senate Hearing, 107TH Congress - Nomination Hearing: Joseph Jwu-Shan Jen and James R. Moseley

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S. HRG.

NOMINATION HEARING FOR JOSEPH JWU-SHAN

ONE HUNDRED SEVENTH CONGRESS

JULY 12, 2001

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U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE

For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office

MARK HALVERSON, Staff Director

Thursday, July 12, 2001

STATEMENTS PRESENTED BY SENATORS

THURSDAY, JULY 12, 2001

STATEMENT OF HON. THOMAS HARKIN, A U.S. SENATOR FROM

Technologists in 1992. This is a very high honor, as there are only

management of REE. My philosophy has always been to focus on

I think what I would like to do is that hopefully, with my experi-

I, too, join with the Indiana delegation represented in rec-

have to have conservation on every piece of agricultural land, work-

guessand I may not be fully aware of everything going on, but

culture today is where is the next generation of farmers going to

of Ag Communication, and the answer was no. We do have a group

JULY 12, 2001

JULY 12, 2001

JULY 12, 2001

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