IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF TENNESSEE AT KNOXVILLE, TENNESSEE

United States of America, Plaintiff, vs. Freddie Marshall Carson, Defendant.

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Case No. 3:12-cr-17

Motion/Pretrial Conference

Transcript of proceedings before the Honorable C. Clifford Shirley, Jr., U. S. Magistrate Judge, on May 8th, 2012. Appearances: On behalf of the Plaintiff: Jennifer Kolman, Esq. U. S. Attorneys Office Knoxville, Tennessee On behalf of the Defendant: Bobby E. Hutson, Jr., Esq. Federal Defender Services, Inc. Knoxville, Tennessee

Court Reporter: Donnetta Kocuba, RMR 800 Market Street, Suite 132 Knoxville, Tennessee 37902 (865) 524-4590

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(Whereupon, Tuesday, May 8 th , 2012, Court convened in the following matter at 2:16 p.m.; Defendant present via telephone.) COURTROOM DEPUTY: Mr. Carson, can you hear me okay still? MR. CARSON (by phone): Yes, maam. COURTROOM DEPUTY: I just wanted to make sure you were still on the line. MR. CARSON: Yes, Im here. COURTROOM DEPUTY: Case Number 3:12-cr-17, United States of America versus Freddie Marshall Carson. Jennifer Kolman is here on behalf of the Government. Is the Government present and ready to proceed? MS. KOLMAN: It is, your Honor. COURTROOM DEPUTY: Bobby Hutson is here on

behalf of the Defendant. Is The Defendant present and ready to proceed? MR. HUTSON: Present and ready, your Honor. THE COURT: All right. Before we begin, Mr. Carson, Ill address you and remind you of a couple things. First off, you still have the right to remain silent and not say anything, and I would encourage you to exercise that right. Number two, youre probably required to, because youre represented by counsel, and for purposes of this hearing, you will essentially speak through counsel; that is, he will speak for you. Do you understand those admonitions?

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MR. CARSON: Yes, sir, your Honor. THE COURT: All right. There may be a time or two that I will address you personally to assure myself that you understand whats going on. If I do, then you may answer at that time, and I will just basically expect either a yes or no. Okay. Do you understand that, Mr. Carson? MR. CARSON: Yes. Yes, sir, Im here. THE COURT: Okay. Did you understand what I just said? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: Okay. Now, I will address you, Mr. Hutson. Looks like I have a couple motions in front of me. First, is the motion for Mr. Carson to waive his appearance and to appear by phone. Obviously, I have been addressing him on the phone. You can probably take from that that Ive granted that motion. I assume the Government has no objection, Ms. Kolman? MS. KOLMAN: No, your Honor. THE COURT: All right. Obviously, Mr. Carson may appear by phone and will also take note that he has filed an affidavit in this case indicating that he has been advised of his speedy trial rights and that he acknowledges that he requests additional time to prepare his case and that that outweighs his right to a speedy trial. That second part relates to the other motion that were taking up here today, which is your motion to continue the trial. I will

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hear from you briefly on that, Mr. Hutson. MR. HUTSON: Your Honor, this is in reference to the motion to continue filed on May 4 th of this year. THE COURT: Why dont you come up to the podium, if you dont mind. MR. HUTSON: Certainly.

THE COURT: Thank you, sir. MR. HUTSON: Your Honor, this in reference to the

May 4 th motion that we filed in this matter. Were asking that the Court continue the case until October of this year. The two parties have spoken before court, and the October 23 rd date is a date that would work with both of our schedules. More importantly, in terms of the substance of our request, we need this time to properly review the discovery from the Government in this matter. The discovery is voluminous. As of now, there are approximately 2,000 pages of discovery, and it is trickling in from time to time, does require additional review on my part. Additionally, there are probably is it three to 5,000 text messages that need to be reviewed in the case from various parties, and all of them relate to Mr. Carson. Additionally, it is paramount for us to be able to advise Mr. Carson on possible motions in the case, and without having an opportunity to review the documentation, it is my fear that I would be unable to do that effectively.

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Also, your Honor, the Defendant, as the Court noted, did file an affidavit. Mr. Carson is fine with the continuance in terms of his speedy trial rights, which were waived via the affidavit in this case. And I would also, lastly, note that the Government is not opposing our motion, is my understanding. THE COURT: All right. Let me here real briefly; then Ill address both of you. Ms. Kolman, does the Government have any position with regard to the motion to continue? MS. KOLMAN: No, your Honor. All that he has said is correct. There is a lot of evidence, and we have been the Governments actually been helping him to kind of sift through it, but it is a lot to digest. THE COURT: All right. I always appreciate the Government providing assistance with regard to collating, pointing out most relevant documents, those type of things, but I dont encourage too much of the trickle down approach. So, at some point, particularly like this month, I expect you to get with the agents and find out what all is left out there, and lets get it done. I dont want to hear that discovery is still trickling in in September. MR. HUTSON: Your Honor, if I could, and this is probably my fault, if I could clarify that comment. I believe some of the discovery thats trickling in is new discovery, things that are happening presently or THE COURT: And I understand that sometimes its

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inevitable and sometimes its a matter of different agencies, different functions, different all kinds of they are excuses, but theyre really good excuses. But at some time and point somebody has to sort of be at the head of the table and get everybody in there and say, okay, lets get it all together. Okay. Im not fussing; Im just pointing that out. All right. At this point, Mr. Hutson, do you know of any motions you would need to file? What Im looking for is, is there any need for me to set a new motion hearing deadline or can we operate on the default rule, which is, if you have a motion to file then you just file a motion telling me why you couldnt file it earlier, submitting me a copy of it. MR. HUTSON: I think that would suffice, your Honor. THE COURT: All right. Did I ask you about October 23 rd as a trial date? Is that okay with the Government, Ms. Kolman? MS. KOLMAN: Thats fine with the Government, your Honor. THE COURT: Will you be handling this now for Ms. Hui? MS. KOLMAN: Yes. THE COURT: All right. And, Mr. Hutson, is that date good for you and Mr. Carson? MR. HUTSON: It is, your Honor.

THE COURT: All right. Ill reset the trial date until October 23 rd , 2012. I do find that all the time between the filing of

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the motion to continue and todays date has been fully excludable for speedy trial purposes as a result of a pending motion. I find that all time between today and October 23 rd to be fully excludable for speedy trial purposes for the reasons stated by counsel, and that is the volumi the fact that discovery is voluminous, and that obviously there is some great need of time to prepare for those documents and prepare clients for trial. And I notice also, as well, for the record, that Mr. Carson is in another state and its necessary for counsel to prepare with some difficulty when that logistical difference exists. So and in the event that any motions need to be filed, then the Court will need time to address those. So for all those reasons, I will grant the motion, set the trial, and find that all the time is fully excludable. As noted, I will not be filing I mean, will not be putting down a new motion deadline. Mr. Hutson, again, my default rule is that, if you determine that you need to file a motion, you will file a couple documents. One is the motion that requests leave to file a motion out of time. In the body of that motion you will tell me two things: number one, why it couldnt have been filed back during the original motion filing deadline, for example, if its new discovery; and the second is a summary of the merits of the motion, why you should be allowed to file it, why you think you might prevail, why you need the relief sought. You will attach to that actually a copy of the motion you

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intend to file so I can review it for myself. Okay? Absent some special need, I wont need a hearing on that. Ill just rule on the papers. The Government may be contacted to see if they have any objection, but because its a motion to file, out of time, that objection will have to be with regard to that issue. We wont be taking up the merits of the motion in an ex parte call; okay? Just so everybody understands. We will need to take up the issue of a plea cutoff date. We need a new plea cutoff date. Normally, we do that a couple weeks before trial. Is that satisfactory with the Government in this case? MS. KOLMAN: Thats fine, your Honor. THE COURT: Well make it October 9 th . All right. Is there anything else on behalf of the Government that we need to take up? MS. KOLMAN: Not today, your Honor.

THE COURT: Im not going to set a new pretrial conference; do you think? At this point, Im not. If anythings filed or theres a need for a pretrial conference, the parties can ask me and I will set it up. Absent that, though, well put down a standard pretrial order. MR. HUTSON: Thank you.

THE COURT: Okay. Anything else on behalf of Mr. Carson at this point? MR. HUTSON: No, your Honor. Thank you.

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THE COURT: Let me address Mr. Carson just real briefly. Mr. Carson youve heard that I am continuing the trial until October 23 rd , 2012. Do you have any objections to that? MR. CARSON: No, sir. THE COURT: Okay. I want to remind you, as I do every defendant who is out on release, when I continue a case, that that can be a good news/bad news situation. The good news is, youre still out and you still get to remain out on those same conditions. Okay? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: And the bad news is, that you still remain out on those conditions, which means that theres still potential for you to violate; and if you did, you would have to be remanded to custody and sit there until the time of trial, which is now going to be in October. Do you understand that? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: Hopefully, that provides you with new and even better incentive to follow those conditions. I should tell you that I have spoken with your Indiana probation officer, and Im advised that you are compliant technically with your conditions. However, I am concerned and have expressed concern, and your probation officer is concerned, you still have not secured employment. MR. CARSON: That is correct, yes. THE COURT: Well, are you making some major strides

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in that area? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir, I am. I have had several job offers, but they were sales job offers, and my probation officer recommended that I could not take those jobs under the conditions of my release. And so I have had to go back and seek other employment, but I have made great strides, yes, and I am doing it every day. THE COURT: Well, strides isnt so much in terms of effort; its in terms of closeness to getting something. MR. CARSON: Very close, yes, sir. THE COURT: I kind of understood that you were going to be able to secure employment, had essentially promises of that if I released you. I think I may have stated on the record I doubted that and its come more true. If you dont get employment, Mr. Carson, you will end up violating. I dont want you to and thats not something Im going to make happen. Im just going to tell you its a truism. Its been my experience that people who arent employed almost always end up violating somewhere along the line. So, for your familys sake, for your own sake, you need to secure employment. I also notice that there may be a I also note there may be a problem with you remaining in the residence that youre currently living in? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: And, you know, before theres any kind

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of eviction proceedings or anything like that, if youre going to be living anywhere else, as I told you before, I need to know that and Im telling Mr. Hutson too I need to know that before you move there. Okay? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: I dont need one day to go by where your probation officer wonders where you are. So I hope none of that comes to pass. I hope you get a job, hope you get to stay in the apartment youre in and get you know, everything works out. But you need to make that happen, Mr. Carson; okay? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: All right. Im going to allow you to stay out on the same conditions. I assume the Government has no objections to that, Ms. Kolman? MS. KOLMAN: No, your Honor. THE COURT: All right. Probation officer is satisfied with those; so am I. Im just sort of giving you a heads up; okay? MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: Did you get that, Mr. Hutson? MR. HUTSON: I did, your Honor. Thank you.

THE COURT: All right. Anything else on behalf of Mr. Carson then today? MR. HUTSON: Nothing, your Honor. Thank you. THE COURT: All right. Mr. Carson, youre welcome to hang up the phone. We are through with this hearing. Court will

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now stand adjourned. MR. CARSON: Yes, sir. THE COURT: All right. Bye-bye. (Hearing concluded at 2:33 p.m.) CERTIFICATION I certify that the foregoing is an accurate transcript of the record of proceedings in the titled matter.

/s/Donnetta Kocuba
Donnetta Kocuba, RPR-RMR Official Court Reporter U.S. District Court Knoxville, Tennessee

4/22/13

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